Prayer, Tragedy, and Sovereignty Pt 1

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All right, this morning, back
to Psalm eighty three. We'll be taking

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a slight detour from where we have
been, but I think we have to

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based on a number of factors.
But Psalm eighty three, that's just a

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kind of a quick reminder of where
we are. Obviously, we identified Psalm

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eighty three as a communal lament,
and we see that primarily in verse one.

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All Right, we have identified,
and we have argued, no matter

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how many other sermons disagree with me, that Psalm eighty three is a lament

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due to circumstances facing those people at
that time. All Right, it's not

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prophetic, it's talking about a situation
at that time. Where Asaph's kind of

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the worship leader under David impossibly at
the beginning reign of Solomon, that he

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composes this lamit to put voice to
the concerns, fears, worry, the

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emotions of the people, and he
cries out to God because they obviously feel

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God has not been involved in the
situation, so he cries out to God.

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He then begins to describe the character, the characteristics and attributes of the

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enemy, which we've gone through that
numerous times. He obviously explains kind of

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what's happening that these enemies, after
describing their characteristics and attributes, one of

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the things that they've done, they
have consulted together. They are working together.

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They've formed a confederacy, all right, and then he names really all

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the people who are a part of
this confederacy. Then, starting in verse

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nine, which is where we have
been. Starting in verse nine, he

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calls for God to act in the
present how he has acted in the past.

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Okay, So, I mean,
it's pretty simple, pretty straightforward.

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Why there's so many difficulties in SAW
eighty three, I don't know, but

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it's simple. It's pretty straightforward.
But we can see that it. I

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mean, I don't I don't understand
why there's any complexity, but it's pretty

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simple and pretty straightforward. So then
the issue came. Okay, so if

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we look at saw maty three and
we kind of understand its basic structure and

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this basic understanding, what do we
do. Do we just say, okay,

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well, SSAW eighty three talks about
a particular situation and this is how

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they cried out to God. Here's
two or three lessons we can learn from

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it. Or do we try to
find more application? Well, the main

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application we took from this is and
there were some basic lessons I gave everyone.

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One of those basic lessons that I've
repeated over and over and over and

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over and over is Psaw eighty three
is a great example of people who believe

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in a God in whom they cannot
see, while living in the midst of

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circumstances that they very much can see, and those circumstances call into question the

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existence and action of the God whom
we cannot see. Also, because Saw

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maybe three clearly mentions all of these
enemies, I compared these characteristics and these

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attributes to the enemies that all Christians
face. So then I once again use

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this same kind of concept that as
believers, we live in a world surrounded

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by enemies which we can see,
and sometimes that makes us forget the enemies

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which we cannot see. So those
are some basic concepts. So we looked

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at all the characteristics and attributes of
the enemy, and we said, okay,

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here's our enemies, and we I
think we're able to prove pretty dogmatically

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that our enemies have the exact same
characteristics and the exact same attributes, which

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make it very applicable without doing any
damage to the text. The next part

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is where things start getting a little
difficult, right, because if we say,

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okay, we have to say that
our enemies have the same characteristics in

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the same attributes. Can then we
expect God to do in our present as

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he has done in their past?
And immediately we know we have to kind

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of call a time out, and
we have to we have to pump the

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brakes because we can all acknowledge a
couple of things. There are numerous things

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God did in the past that no
reasonable person other than crazy charismatics, and

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even their claims always prove to be
fraudulent. We cannot expect I don't even

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think we should be asking for God
to do in the present as he has

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done in the past. Can we
agree on that or no? Because I

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mean, I can just go through
a number of actions right, right,

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cannot go through a number right?
I mean, do you think he's gonna

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be parting the Red Sea? Do
you think he's going to be raining food

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down from heaven? I mean,
if so, he could stop the starvation

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problem in five point two seconds,
right, Okay, water from a rock

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his actual chakana glory, as it
sometimes referred to by some dwelling and the

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tabernacle or the temple speaking directly to
us. I know charismatics believe he's speaking

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directly to us, But for all
reasonable people, well, if he's speaking

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directly to us, then we don't
need what we don't need the Bible,

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all right, So clearly he's not
doing I mean, I can go raising

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people from the dead. I mean
I can go on and on. I

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mean, how many things do I
need to go? Stopping storms? Like?

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I mean, we can go on
and on and on. Obviously those

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things are not happening, which causes
what which raises questions? Right, because

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we say all of these things and
we're like, okay, God, we

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are facing very difficult circumstances. Do
in the present as you've done in the

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past, and can we expect that
to happen? I think I think we're

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foolish to think that it's going to
happen. I mean, come on,

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I mean, I've been alive long
enough to know those things are not happening,

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right, People are not being raised
from the dead, and all the

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things that we can read in scripture
which calls into question many would you that

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very fact to call into question the
existence of God? And even charismatics in

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twenty twenty four, they still make
a lot of their claims, but it's

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very difficult to maintain those claims in
twenty twenty four. You know the reason

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why, because everything that happens is
videotaped in twenty twenty four, is it

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not everything? Right? I mean, there's video cameras everywhere, so all

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these supposed miracles should be what clearly
documented, right, But every single time

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they make the claims, someone goes
investigated and it never turns out the way

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it's supposed to turn out. So
I think, so that's already causing us.

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Well, then what do we take
from him asking God to do in

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the past and doing the present as
He has done in the past. Well,

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for them, I think we have
some possible explanations, but for us,

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I don't know if it's going to
be able to be applicable. So

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we're working through all of those things, right. The first thing we looked

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at was in verse nine where he
says deal with them as with midian right,

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and we dealt We looked at everything
that happened in that account with how

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they dealt with the Midianites, and
that's found in Judges chapter four through six.

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I believe correct, all right,
And so we looked at that.

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Now we will go back and we'll
review it in the second hour. But

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so as I was looking at all
of that, obviously two big things have

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happened in our world since we've been
looking at Psalm eighty three. All right.

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The first thing that occurred and that
everyone in the world is talking about

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is the assassination attempt on Donald Trump. All right, everyone's been talking about

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it. Not only has everyone been
talking about it, many people, even

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some Christians. If you look even
at comments under the Christian Post and some

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Christian websites, many are raising some
very uncomfortable questions to Christians. And the

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response from Christians to those people is
basically, shut up, you atheists.

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You don't believe in God, and
that cannot be our great intellectual approach to

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this. Not only are Christians bringing
it up. Bill Maher, who's obviously

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not a Christian, on his program
Real Time he went just absolutely off on

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Christians, and I can't repeat half
the things he said, but bringing in

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some of the exact same questions and
and trouble that a lot of people are

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bringing up for some weird reason,
these issues being brought up. Every Christian

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sitting in the pew should have been
struggling with this their entire Christian life.

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But as soon as someone brings it
up to Christians, the people sitting in

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the pew get defensive and they push
back, and they don't like it,

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and they get upset. And I
don't understand why, because if you believe,

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if you read your Bible, you
should have been struggling with this.

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I don't know your entire Christian life. So because of that, second thing

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that happened was the fire that happened
at First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas,

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the historic sanctuary that was built with
eighteen ninety collapse. The roof collapsed,

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and it's been a big thing in
the way many Christians have responded to

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that fire. The same the same
questions have been brought up. So I'm

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like, well, we're in SSAW
eighty three. I could circle back to

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this at the end of psawm eighty
three, but we're right in the middle

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of a very important section. So
if you have your bibles, look at

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SSAW eighty three. I'm going to
give you specific verses. I want you

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to read these verses and i want
you to see what question should immediately come

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to your mind when you read these
verses. Now, I know the question

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is not going to come to your
mind because nobody in church asked this question.

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But everyone should, all right.
Psalm eighty three, Verse one,

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What do we have? In Psalm
eighty three, Verse one? What do

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we what would we call that?
What is it called? When you talk

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to God? A prayer? Okay? Got right? This is not complicated,

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all right? So in verse one
do we have a prayer? Go?

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Okay? Are we not in agreement
there? Okay, it's prayer?

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Right? He says, do not
keep silent, Oh God, do not

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hold your peace, and do not
be still? Oh God? Okay,

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he's addressing it to God. Can
we agree? All right? What happens

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in verse nine? That's a prayer? Is he not talking to God?

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Is he not talking to God?
Okay? It's prayer? Ladies and gentlemen.

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Deal with them as with Midian?
He who is he asking to deal

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with them? God? All right? Deal with them? So to verse

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one? Can everyone say he's talking
to God? Verse nine? Is he

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addressing God? Verse thirteen? Oh
my God, make them like the whirling

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dust? Yes? All right?
So three specific verses are specifically demonstrates that.

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I mean, we already identified it
as a lament, a lament as

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a cry out to God, so
we obviously have identified it the whole psalm

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as that, but we have three
specific verses where Asap is in a sense

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composing this so that the people can
pray directly to God. And they're praying

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directly to God because of circumstances which
they are facing. And when people pray

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to God during a difficult situation,
painful situation, tragic situation, frightful situation,

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what are people asking God to do
to intervene? Right, to do

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something correct? Okay, now what
is the problem with that? Okay,

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this is what everyone has been pointing
out on and comment sections and all over

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the place, and they keep addressing
it to Christians and Christians keep getting mad.

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As said, are responding in a
correct way. We have to address

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this. So if you didn't hear
what she said, I'm gonna phrase it

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in a different way. But so
let's go through this. I've given you

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some specific kind of lessons from psaw
Many three. Right, So saw Many

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three is a good example of people
who believe in God and whom they cannot

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see while living in a world are
surrounded by circumstances which we can see,

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which calls into question the existence of
the God whom we cannot see. That

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we live in a world surrounded by
enemies which we can see. That sometimes

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makes us forget the enemies in which
we cannot see. Those are two basic

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lessons. I'm going to give you
a third, and nobody is going to

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like this one. Okay, I'm
not even saying this is a I'm not

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going to present this necessarily as a
lesson, but I want you to definitely

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write this down to the best of
your ability. It's way too long,

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but I wrote it out in a
very long way because I used it in

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the podcast. But you can shorten
it, you can summarize it however you

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would like. Okay, I was
going to ask Ai to summarize it,

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but I'd like, no, I
want it written out, Longhand because it

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shows how trying to process this.
Are you ready? As Christians, we

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pray to a God whom we cannot
see to act in some way to help

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with circumstances we can see. Would
everyone agree that that's a fair assessment and

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how most Christians pray. As Christians, we pray to a God whom we

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cannot see, to act in some
way to help with circumstances we can see.

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Almost in every prayer we're asking God
to do what to act, And

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almost in every circumstance we're asking him
to act in what way, to change

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a circumstance, to improve a circumstance, to literally do something right. Whatever

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the case may be, we're acting
him to do something. Agreed, Go

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to any prayer meeting. It's God, I can't see you. Here's circumstances.

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Don't we not tell God the circumstances? And then we ask God sometimes

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specific things to do. Fix this, change this, He'll this person,

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stop this, make this better,
over and over and over and over.

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All. Right, we do this
even though the God whom we cannot see

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at the very minimum, knew the
circumstances would happen before he even created the

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world, and he allowed those circumstances
to happen. Right, let me do

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that again. As Christians, we
pray to a God in whom we cannot

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see, to act in some way
to help with circumstances we can see,

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even though the God we cannot see
at the minimum knew the circumstances would happen

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before he even created the world,
and he allowed those circumstances to happen,

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and he did nothing to stop them. Right, that's at the minimum.

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Does everyone see the conflict there and
saw mayighty three? Who are they praying

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to a god whom, at the
very minimum knew that this confederacy of nations

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would form, and at the very
minimum did absolutely nothing to stop it from

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forming or stop it from coming against
Israel. So now you're gonna pray to

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a god who knew was going to
happen, did nothing to stop it from

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happening. Now to intervene to stop
it from happening. Right, that's that's

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how do you? How do you
wrap your mind around it? But can

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we can go a step farther?
That's at the minimum. Now at the

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maximum, Oh, this is where
problems began. Everyone grabbed the Trinity Hymnal,

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the Trinity Hymnal and turned to page
eight hundred and fifty. Page eight

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hundred and fifty, this is the
Westminster Confession of Faith. It reads identical

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almost to the London Baptist Confession of
Faith. Everyone really look at chapter three

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and what is chapter three called?
Okay? Now, what's a decree.

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A decree is where you decrease something
that is to happen, right, like

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a decree an order that this is
going to happen. And this speaks of

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something that's an eternal decree. Well
that could be a little troubling, could

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it not, because this is a
decree that's come from eternity. Now look

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at up, that's chapter three.
Look at paragraph one. You read paragraph

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one to yourself. Now, those
who will listen to this online, I'll

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read it here in a second,
but I want everyone to read it for

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themselves. We've covered this countless times
on the podcast. See you keep phrasing

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that paragraph, whatsoever comes to pass? Everybody see that you may want to

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write those words down. Whatsoever comes
to pass God from all eternity, did

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by the most wise and holy counsel
of his own will freely? And oh

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now see that's a really that's a
troubling word. Does everybody see that?

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That's a troubling word? Is it
not? Unchangeably ordains? Whatsoever comes to

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pass? Now? Whatsoever comes to
pass? Why is that troubling? Okay,

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good and bad? Right, whatsoever
comes to past? Look, people

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continue and all of this discussion about
the assassination attempt. Christian's every where almost

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treating now Trump almost like he's a
demi God. It's frightening, right,

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all the things people are saying.
But it's like, you know, God

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protected him, he was covered in
the armor of God. Jesus was there,

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Jesus directed the bullet. Jesus,
Jesus. And it's like, what

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about Corey who was trying to protect
his family. Nobody even remembers his name.

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He died, Oh, but Trump
was spared. Well, so God

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could be at the same event and
he's like, oh, this bullet,

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but I can't reach over to stop
Corey from dying while he's trying to protect

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his family. Whatsoever comes to pass
would include both and the two other individuals

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nobody even knows their names who was
severely wounded. One was like seventy seven,

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seventy eight. We don't know.
I don't know their conditions as of

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late, right, But no,
it's just Trump, Trump, Trump,

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Trump, Trump, He's almost God. Well, what about the other person?

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I guess he just gets forgotten.
Now some people have remembered him.

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Great, that's awesome, but that's
a troubling thing. And forget just that.

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Do you realize on that particular day. How many people died from all

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kinds of things, how many children
were molested, how many women were raped.

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I mean, we can go on
and on and on and on of

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all the things that happened on that
particular day. So we have no problem

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saying God intervenes. But typically when
we say God intervenes, we usually always

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reference it in regards to that which
is positive in happening. Right, and

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somehow we got to get God off
the hook for all the bad. But

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there is his eternal degree. But
what word there is? Which word of

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all of the two? I think
there's two words there that are troubling.

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Which one do you find most troubling? Unchangeably or whatsoever? Which one?

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Which one is unchangeable? And whatsoever? Which one? Which word is more

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troubling to you as a believer unchangeable
to me? Especially if we considering I

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just all my introduction was dealing with
what concept prayer that calls into some serious

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issues? Does it not? Does
anyone? Not? Anyone? See it?

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Okay? Thank you canfinally now go
to I think chapter five of the

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Westminster and what's the title of that
chapter? The Providence? Everyone read paragraph

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one. We need to probably work
through both of these chapters. But I've

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been telling people for twenty three years
to read the London Baptist Confession of Faith.

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So on the podcast I told everyone
spent all week reading this over and

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over and over and over and over
and over and over. What stands out

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in this paragraph Chapter five, Paragraph
one of the Westminster or London Baptist Confession

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of Faith, God, the great
creator of all things, doth number one,

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upholled number two, directs, number
three, dispose number four governs all

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creatures. Next word actions. Okay, if you're not getting a little uncomfortable

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right now, I don't know what
to tell you. Okay, that is

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disturbing beyond anything I can even wrap
my mind. I don't even know if

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there's anything more disturbing than that.
Okay, actions things from the greatest even

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to the least, by His most
wise and holy providence, according to His

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infallible fore knowledge and the free and
immutable. What's the idea of immutable?

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Oh, we have the unchanging concept
again, immutable counsel of his own will.

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Okay, we're running into a problem, are we not? Is anybody

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not starting to feel it? Now? Let me go back to that thing

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I was giving out to you,
because now we can complete it. As

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Christians, we pray to a God
in whom we cannot see, to act

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in some way to help with circumstances
we can see. Even though the God

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we cannot see, at the very
minimum knew the circumstances would happen before he

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even created the world, and allowed
those circumstances to happen, and did absolutely

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nothing to stop them. And at
the most God decreed them, guided them,

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and directed them to happen. And
my last words were, what then

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are we praying for? What then
are we praying for? So at the

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very least God knew it, and
God allowed it and did nothing to stop

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it. So that seems kind of
odd to then pray for God to do

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something in it. Says He's the
one who knew it and allowed it.

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Right, If if a parent was
sitting here in this church, right and

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we looked outside and we're like,
why is their kid in the freeway?

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Why is the kid in the freeway? We would probably go immediately to the

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parent and say, your kid is
in the freeway. And if the parent

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said, I knew that we're going
to be in the freeway. I allowed

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them to be in the freeway.
It would really not make any sense to

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go to that parent to do anything
about it. So then we have two

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choices. What's our two choices except
the parents will or say you're an idiot.

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I'm going to do something about it
now. So right there, we

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already know what do we do?
What do we do? What? You

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would realize if that parent knew it
and allowed it, it would be really

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a waste of time to go to
said parent. Well, it seems kind

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of confusing to go to the very
God who knew it in all it to

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do anything about it. Says he's
the one who knew it and allowed it.

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But it even goes a step further, depending on your theology. If

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you believe that God is decreate everything
whatsoever comes to pass. And now I

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did decree it, He guided it, directed it, disposed it all.

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He did everything the things, He
controls the things, even the actions and

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the creatures. Seems absolute. In
fact, could you not say, now,

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now nobody's gonna like this. If
we're praying for God to do something

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different, we're not praying in accordance
to his will that that's going to go

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over really well, isn't it either
you believe it it's God's will or you

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believe it's not God. If you're
praying for God to do something against it

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or to change it, you're literally
then what are you doing? What are

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00:27:00.319 --> 00:27:03.279
you saying? When you pray for
God to change a circumstance do something in

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a circumstance, you're obviously praying that
it's not You're praying against God's will.

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If God decrees everything to come to
pass, are you not? Now?

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In the modern church, nobody cares
about any of this. Nobody wants to

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talk about it. Nobody cares even
when you listen to pastors, because all

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week on the podcast it's about finding
random sermons on God's decrees and God's providence.

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Even the sermons I've listened to that
a few of them have admitted,

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I don't know. I don't know
what to do with any of this.

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It makes absolutely no sense. It
doesn't make any sense. I don't know

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what to do with it. A
few admitted that. But guess what,

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Nobody wanted to address this whole prayer
thing. Nobody wanted to touch it because

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the implications of it are that most
likely, if depending again, now,

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we can throw out God's sovereign if
you want to throw out God's sovereignty here

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and throw out the Westminster Confession about
God's eternal decrees, if you want to

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throw that out. Okay, But
even then you still got a God who

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knew it and allowed it. But
if you have a God who decreed it,

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then that would indicate that there's a
high probability that in your life you

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engaged in what practice praying against God's
will? And do you think you can

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convince anyone that that's a sin?
Are we to accept God's will or to

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go against God's will? What do
you think brings up about a million?

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Right? So? Then, how
so? Then this is the question we

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should ask, not what are we
praying for? How should we then pray?

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Okay, right, how should Well
here's what we're gonna do. I

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know the modern church nobody cares about
this, But in church history people have

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been fighting about this for two thousand
years. Just nobody in the modern church

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cares to look at all the fighting
over it, and there's some really strange

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ways of looking at You want to
go through church history and see how they

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00:29:19.279 --> 00:29:23.559
handled it. Sounds good, Okay, that's what we're doing anyway, So

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you just as well say okay,
cause that I mean, I spent all

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week looking up the history, so
somebody better say, man, okay,

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are you ready? All right,
here we go. Let's we'll do work

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after the Okay, at the hang
on, at the most I think is

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the way I put it down,
and at the most God decreed them,

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guided and directed them to happen.
What then are we praying for? Okay,

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so we're gonna we're gonna start with
the reformed calvinistic perspective. And the

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reason we're going to going to start
with the reform calvinistic perspective probably makes sense

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why we're gonna start there, right, because we hold to which confession of

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00:30:12.839 --> 00:30:33.359
faith? Okay? All right,
okay, not we only know what is

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revealed? Will is which is in
the word right right right right? I

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know that. Well, hopefully we'll
figure that out. I don't have a

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good answer at the moment, but
we're going to see how far we can

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get. That's what we're gonna look
at. We're gonna see how people in

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church history try to answer that question. Is what we're gonna hope to do.

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Right, So we're gonna start with
the reform perspective. And the reason

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we're gonna start with the reform perspective
is because as we just looked, what

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hymnal do we have in our church? The Trinity to hymnals? What confession

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is at the end of it?
The Westminster a Reformed confession. We hold

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to the London Baptist Confession of Faith, all right, which reads just like

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that reads the same in those chapters. So because we kind of we hold

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to at least some level of reform
soteriology and a reformed understanding of God's sovereignty,

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then the most obvious is how did
the reformers handle this? Right?

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So are you ready to kind of
work on this? Here we go,

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all right, here are the philological
perspectives on prayer in times of suffering.

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So we're gonna look at thiological perspectives
on prayer in times of suffering, right,

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00:31:52.000 --> 00:31:56.240
the reformed calvinistic perspective. Now,
I'm going to kind of go through

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00:31:56.279 --> 00:31:59.279
this. Then I'm going to kind
of go through the same material and more

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00:31:59.279 --> 00:32:01.640
detailed. This is kind of just
trying to summarize things and very like almost

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00:32:01.640 --> 00:32:06.960
bullet statements. You're ready, God, Okay? So from a reform perspective,

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you begin with God's sovereignty. God
has decreed all events, including tragedy,

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for his purpose. So the reform
perspective is before I'd even begin to

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pray, whenever you come to me
and say, hey, pray for this,

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what perspective does a reform person begin, if you truly hold a reform

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00:32:30.000 --> 00:32:35.240
theology, what perspective do you hold
at that very moment that I'm going to

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00:32:35.279 --> 00:32:42.839
be praying about something that God has
decreed, including the tragedy. Now,

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you don't probably want to tell the
person who asks you to pray that that's

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what you believe. Now, let
me state it so many times. This

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is so true that this is a
this is a dogmatic fact. If you

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take what Christians believe, and I'll
call this our theoretical, our theoretical theology

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kind of what we may talk about
in a seminary, what we may talk

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00:33:07.519 --> 00:33:16.079
about sitting in church. Our theoretical
theology almost never transfers to where practical theology

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never. There's always a world of
contradiction between our theoretical, our theoretical,

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and our practical. Right, it's
just a complete, utter inconsistency. And

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when you try to point out the
inconsistency. People in the pew do what.

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They get defensive, they get argumentative, they get mad, and they'll

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leave because I don't want to be
confronted with a contradiction between their theoretical and

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they're practical. And I could go
through a thousand examples. Here's a good

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example. Those are reformed, we
should start out, Hey, we're gonna

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pray, okay, just so that
we know what we pray about. We're

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00:33:59.119 --> 00:34:06.359
praying about circuitcumstances and situations that God
has already eternally decreed and he's guiding and

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directing in his providence. So exactly
what do you want me to pray for?

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Because it sounds like you want me
to pray that God would change the

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circumstance, but God decrayed the circumstance, so you want me to pray against

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God's obvious will. Now you don't
say that to people. So typically those

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who are reformed, when it comes
to praying, how do we pray as

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00:34:30.239 --> 00:34:35.559
someone who doesn't believe God has decreed
everything that comes to pass? Because if

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we did, we would have to
pray radically different than the way we pray.

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So from a reform perspective, how
do we pray. Well, before

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00:34:46.480 --> 00:34:51.079
we get to the prayer, let's
do this as reformed, where do you

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start that? Whatever you want me
to pray about, God has already decreed

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it and he's guiding it. Now
you said, well, how do I

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pray with that in mind? I
have no idea. I don't even know

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where to begin. I'm gonna give
you some examples of how one. I've

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got an example of how one could
pray. All right, So what is

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the purpose of prayer? Then?
From that perspective, from the Westminster perspective,

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from the Westminster and London Baptist Confession
perspective on God's eternal decree and God's

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providence, what then would be the
purpose of prayer? Well, let's do

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00:35:28.920 --> 00:35:31.280
this. What would not be the
purpose of prayer? According to the London

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00:35:31.280 --> 00:35:37.559
Baptist Confession of Faith Paragraph one,
Chapter three, Paragraph one, Chapter five,

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what would be what would not be
the purpose of prayer? If we

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00:35:40.639 --> 00:35:50.559
truly believe those two paragraphs and those
confessions of faith asking God to change it,

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00:35:50.559 --> 00:35:57.760
it's unchangeable. And not only that
he's doing I mean the confessions talked

403
00:35:57.760 --> 00:36:00.920
about he's doing his will, his
own free will. Who am I to

404
00:36:00.920 --> 00:36:08.760
pray? Against God's will, you
say, because somebody say, well,

405
00:36:08.800 --> 00:36:13.960
what is God's will? How could
we answer that according to those confessions of

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00:36:13.960 --> 00:36:22.840
faith, what is God's will?
Whatever happens? Well, that's troubling.

407
00:36:24.280 --> 00:36:28.079
Does that make you almost want to
throw up? Makes me almost want to

408
00:36:28.079 --> 00:36:31.039
throw up? Because that would include
six million Jews being exterminated in World War

409
00:36:31.079 --> 00:36:40.280
two? Look up how many children
have been molested in churches since say nineteen

410
00:36:40.360 --> 00:36:52.239
seventy. The numbers are absolutely frightening
in churches. I mean, like,

411
00:36:54.280 --> 00:36:58.880
that's not it. I'm just looking
at the horrible stuff, right right,

412
00:36:59.119 --> 00:37:05.079
So so the purpose of prayer would
appear to us just love. Look,

413
00:37:05.119 --> 00:37:10.639
this is just a logical inference that
if God decrees everything and he and he's

414
00:37:10.960 --> 00:37:15.480
guiding and controlling. Remember how the
Westminster put it in chapter five, paragraph

415
00:37:15.480 --> 00:37:24.679
one, he guides what creatures actions
things according to what does it say something

416
00:37:24.679 --> 00:37:38.920
about his will? In chapter five
paragraph one? There you go. Yeah,

417
00:37:39.000 --> 00:37:44.199
in no other way, They're not
about us. They had nothing to

418
00:37:44.239 --> 00:37:46.880
do with us. I hate to
say it. It almost feels like we're

419
00:37:46.920 --> 00:37:52.199
pawns on a big chess board.
And I know that Christians hate that analogy.

420
00:37:52.519 --> 00:37:55.119
Many atheist and agnostic will describe it
that way and like, no,

421
00:37:55.480 --> 00:38:00.039
it's not like that, because we
want God to be much more manageable.

422
00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:05.440
This is not we manage God.
God's managing us, right, Okay,

423
00:38:05.559 --> 00:38:08.599
don't I don't necessarily like that.
Okay, But so we know what the

424
00:38:08.639 --> 00:38:13.960
purpose of prayer is. Not it
doesn't appear now I'm gonna put this just

425
00:38:14.159 --> 00:38:16.639
because people on the internet will get
mad, I'm gonna state this as a

426
00:38:16.760 --> 00:38:22.000
hypothesis. All right. I'm not
being dogmatic. I'm just saying the logical

427
00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:27.960
inference from those statements and those confessions
of faith. If we believe that it

428
00:38:28.000 --> 00:38:30.880
would be very difficult to then how
do I then bring in asking God to

429
00:38:31.000 --> 00:38:36.800
change that which he decreed, in
which he's guiding and directing for his own

430
00:38:36.840 --> 00:38:38.760
will. It seems like I'm going
against his will. That would have to

431
00:38:38.800 --> 00:38:43.559
be inferred. So then what would
be the purpose of prayer? All right?

432
00:38:43.639 --> 00:38:52.800
Are you ready? Prayer is a
means through which God accomplishes his will?

433
00:38:53.440 --> 00:38:59.079
Well, God wouldn't need my prayer
to accomplish his will with it.

434
00:38:59.519 --> 00:39:06.280
That doesn't seem to make any sense. Now, how about this prayer aligns

435
00:39:06.880 --> 00:39:15.159
the believer with God's sovereign plan and
provide strength and comfort. Now, when

436
00:39:15.159 --> 00:39:17.960
we say it aligns us with God's
will, that means then we would pray

437
00:39:19.039 --> 00:39:30.960
in what way God, I'm accepting
your will, am trusting you for it.

438
00:39:31.239 --> 00:39:37.599
The only problem is nobody, even
in the Bible really prays that way.

439
00:39:38.360 --> 00:39:45.599
Jesus did. How about Psaw eighty
three. Sometimes, Yeah, I

440
00:39:45.599 --> 00:39:50.639
mean there's a lot of prayers to
change circumstances, are there not. We

441
00:39:50.719 --> 00:39:52.880
may have to go through and see, but we have to have to.

442
00:39:53.079 --> 00:39:57.320
I mean even Abram when he's praying
about Sodom and Gomore, I mean he's

443
00:39:57.400 --> 00:40:01.159
he wants God to do what and
he keeps making a deal. God goes

444
00:40:01.199 --> 00:40:07.119
along with it because God already knows
he's going to do it. It's another

445
00:40:07.159 --> 00:40:08.920
way. So, like, this
is a very complicated matter, right,

446
00:40:08.920 --> 00:40:12.760
because I'm just saying Asaw many three. The psawmist does not saying, Hey,

447
00:40:12.760 --> 00:40:16.039
God, your will has been to
form a confederacy against us, We

448
00:40:16.079 --> 00:40:19.960
trust and accept in your will.
No, He's like, do what,

449
00:40:23.159 --> 00:40:28.679
Well, that's I know that's another
complicated matter in it. So but so,

450
00:40:29.199 --> 00:40:30.119
but at least from our revie.
So at the end of yeah,

451
00:40:30.599 --> 00:40:35.599
in that case, you can't say
necessarily is wrong because but because God decreed

452
00:40:35.639 --> 00:40:37.239
it. But then then we get
into disc God decrease in and now we

453
00:40:37.280 --> 00:40:39.719
get into secondary causes, and okay, now becomes a mess. Right,

454
00:40:39.840 --> 00:40:44.119
So before we get all that to
go down that far into the to the

455
00:40:44.239 --> 00:40:49.440
rabbit trail, let's let's do this. Let's at least acknowledge that the primary

456
00:40:49.480 --> 00:40:54.159
purpose from a reform perspective is more
me saying God, I accept your sovereignty,

457
00:40:54.360 --> 00:41:00.880
I accept your power, I accept
your decree, I accept yourdence in

458
00:41:00.920 --> 00:41:06.800
this particular situation, even though because
I think it is absolutely fair in prayer

459
00:41:06.880 --> 00:41:14.719
to do what to speak what you're
feeling. That's the one strong thing about

460
00:41:14.719 --> 00:41:17.599
the lament palm, like Psalm eighty
three, because the lament psalm is where

461
00:41:17.599 --> 00:41:23.599
you express what your raw emotion.
Right. Hey, eh, God,

462
00:41:23.639 --> 00:41:27.920
I understand this is the way you
may be working it, but I'm just

463
00:41:27.960 --> 00:41:31.159
going to express to you this is
not the way I want it now.

464
00:41:31.400 --> 00:41:35.840
How The purpose there, though,
I think, is mainly as you are

465
00:41:35.880 --> 00:41:39.360
struggling with God by doing what you
are acknowledging. Here's the main thing I

466
00:41:39.360 --> 00:41:46.559
think you're doing in prayer. You
are acknowledging the God whom you cannot see

467
00:41:46.800 --> 00:41:53.000
his working in the circumstances which you
can see. Even though those circumstances would

468
00:41:53.039 --> 00:41:59.760
call into the existence of the God
whom you cannot see, you're kind of

469
00:41:59.760 --> 00:42:05.599
acknowledging his existence and acknowledging that your
difficulty with it. Does that make some

470
00:42:05.760 --> 00:42:13.400
sense? I hope that makes some
sense? Okay? So through prayer,

471
00:42:14.079 --> 00:42:16.440
this is how one would say it. Believers would are showing their trust.

472
00:42:16.599 --> 00:42:22.679
They trusting God's decrees, even those
involving suffering, and ultimately for their for

473
00:42:22.880 --> 00:42:24.880
their good and His glory. Ultimately, what you're demonstrating by coming to God

474
00:42:24.920 --> 00:42:28.320
and you're saying, God, I
trust you, even though I don't understand

475
00:42:28.320 --> 00:42:32.639
any of this. But you're not
really asking God to change anything. You're

476
00:42:32.679 --> 00:42:37.679
just coming to God acknowledging your sovereign. Now, you may express your emotions,

477
00:42:37.920 --> 00:42:42.719
but you're and you may express what
you would ultimately desire, but you're

478
00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:45.639
ultimately saying God, what you desire
more than what I desire. I think

479
00:42:45.760 --> 00:42:50.000
someone said it. I don't know
who. Someone said. Someone throw out

480
00:42:50.000 --> 00:42:53.360
the word Jesus. Was you okay? Right? Jesus is a good example

481
00:42:53.400 --> 00:42:57.920
of this. God. I would
like for this cup to pass, but

482
00:42:58.039 --> 00:43:07.199
not my will, But you're right
that that made me the best example of

483
00:43:07.239 --> 00:43:14.400
it. Calvin taught that prayer is
a way for believers to submit to God's

484
00:43:14.400 --> 00:43:19.480
will and find solace and his sovereignty. So the way Calvin understood it is,

485
00:43:19.679 --> 00:43:24.599
guess what you're doing in prayer.
You're coming and submitting to God's will.

486
00:43:24.760 --> 00:43:30.519
You're not coming to change God's will. Oh that's I don't even know

487
00:43:30.519 --> 00:43:35.639
how you would run a prayer meeting
like that. Can you imagine if you

488
00:43:35.679 --> 00:43:37.960
told Christians that this is what we're
going to do in a prayer meeting,

489
00:43:37.960 --> 00:43:40.880
how many would be offended? They
probably would leave and never come back.

490
00:43:49.880 --> 00:43:52.880
Right, God, you know what's
happening in every circumstance, and we submit

491
00:43:52.960 --> 00:44:00.239
to the right. Okay, here's
another way of describing it. In the

492
00:44:00.280 --> 00:44:06.480
Reformed world, prayer serves primarily as
a means for believers to align themselves with

493
00:44:06.519 --> 00:44:10.360
the sovereign will of God. Calvinists
believe that God's will is immutable and that

494
00:44:10.440 --> 00:44:15.880
his plan is perfect and comprehensive.
Therefore, prayer is not seen as a

495
00:44:15.880 --> 00:44:20.360
way to change God's mind or alter
his plans. Instead, it is a

496
00:44:20.360 --> 00:44:23.480
way for believers to grow in their
understanding of God's will, to express their

497
00:44:23.519 --> 00:44:29.920
dependence on him, and to align
their desires and actions with His purposes.

498
00:44:30.119 --> 00:44:36.159
Through prayer, believers seek to conform
their hearts and minds to God's will,

499
00:44:36.519 --> 00:44:40.440
trusting in his sovereignty and wisdom and
all things. Did you hear that?

500
00:44:43.440 --> 00:44:47.079
So? In the reform perspective,
prayer serves what number one as a means

501
00:44:47.119 --> 00:44:57.960
to align yourself with His will.
Why because His will is immutable, perfect

502
00:44:57.960 --> 00:45:01.760
and comprehensive, and the Calvinistic view, prayer is not seen as a way

503
00:45:01.840 --> 00:45:10.480
to do what change God's mind or
alter his plan. As a believer praise

504
00:45:12.239 --> 00:45:15.920
he is hopefully growing in their understanding
of God's will. Because you're talking about

505
00:45:15.920 --> 00:45:21.400
the circumstance and you're accepting it as
God's will. You're also expressing your dependence

506
00:45:21.519 --> 00:45:23.480
on him. Hey, God,
I don't understand your will, but I

507
00:45:23.519 --> 00:45:29.320
am going to depend on you in
it. And you align your action and

508
00:45:29.360 --> 00:45:34.079
your desire with His purpose. Your
actions are not going to go contrary to

509
00:45:34.119 --> 00:45:37.679
God's plan. Now you do realize
how this can get very dangerous, and

510
00:45:37.840 --> 00:45:43.199
make sure you understand this can get
very dangerous, and this has had some

511
00:45:43.280 --> 00:45:49.320
serious bad outcomes in church history,
right, does everybody understand how this has

512
00:45:49.400 --> 00:45:53.199
not gone so well in church history? Mom has a baby that's sick.

513
00:45:58.119 --> 00:46:01.840
It could easily be fixed by taking
it to the hospital. The mom doesn't

514
00:46:01.840 --> 00:46:12.400
take baby to the hospital because I
would be going against God's and many children

515
00:46:12.440 --> 00:46:22.960
have died because of that. Now, what we would say is, well,

516
00:46:22.079 --> 00:46:27.920
that is not what we're saying.
But in a roundabout way, you

517
00:46:27.920 --> 00:46:30.880
could see the logical inference could get
you there. Could you not see people

518
00:46:30.920 --> 00:46:35.440
sitting in the pew who've tried to
figure this out have gone to some really

519
00:46:35.480 --> 00:46:37.800
bizarre places. And we sit back, and so this is where we're like,

520
00:46:37.880 --> 00:46:40.119
well, that person's an idiot.
They should do this, and they

521
00:46:40.119 --> 00:46:43.639
should do this, and they should
do that. But if prayer is simply

522
00:46:43.679 --> 00:46:46.559
me accepting God's will, and God's
the one decreeing everything that comes to past,

523
00:46:46.960 --> 00:46:51.679
and I submit my actions, then
I would do no action that would

524
00:46:51.679 --> 00:47:01.239
seem contrary to his That's typically where
we're like, no, no, no,

525
00:47:01.239 --> 00:47:04.000
no, no, no no,
We're not going to go there,

526
00:47:04.719 --> 00:47:07.280
right, So then what do we
do at that moment? Are we truly

527
00:47:07.360 --> 00:47:16.719
believing that God is sovereign over the
situation? That's the that's the You see

528
00:47:16.760 --> 00:47:20.480
the difficulty there. Now you could
argue, well, I'm gonna take my

529
00:47:20.559 --> 00:47:22.280
child to the hospital. The child
gets better, then the child gets better,

530
00:47:22.360 --> 00:47:25.239
and if the child dies, the
child dies. But God's will be

531
00:47:25.320 --> 00:47:28.599
done, right. I guess you
could kind of try to approach it from

532
00:47:28.599 --> 00:47:30.639
that way, but some would still
may But you're still going again, You're

533
00:47:30.639 --> 00:47:35.440
still trying to take in action.
If God's the one who decreed the sickness,

534
00:47:35.519 --> 00:47:40.519
then why are you fighting against the
sickness? You see how this could

535
00:47:40.639 --> 00:47:44.559
lead to some trouble, do you
not? I mean, we got to

536
00:47:44.599 --> 00:47:49.719
be honest here, this could lead
to some really difficult situations, right So

537
00:47:50.000 --> 00:47:52.280
through prayer, believer seeks to conform
their hearts and mind to God's will,

538
00:47:52.280 --> 00:47:57.960
trusting in his sovereignty. Right now, So I didn't know what to do

539
00:47:58.000 --> 00:48:00.400
with this. I was like,
well, okay, So I kept thinking,

540
00:48:00.639 --> 00:48:02.199
what does that look like? Like? What does that look like?

541
00:48:02.239 --> 00:48:06.480
I have no idea what to do
with this, right, So I just

542
00:48:06.559 --> 00:48:08.880
kept thinking, I'm like, you
know what I'll do. I'm going to

543
00:48:08.960 --> 00:48:15.920
ask Ai to write a prayer according
to the reform perspective, because I'm like,

544
00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:17.760
I have no idea what to do
like, I don't think I've ever

545
00:48:17.800 --> 00:48:21.400
even heard a prayer like that.
Have anybody else ever heard a prayer like

546
00:48:21.440 --> 00:48:25.519
that? The best I can come
up with is what Sarah said right when

547
00:48:25.599 --> 00:48:30.039
Jesus said, now I will be
your will be done. I mean,

548
00:48:30.079 --> 00:48:31.920
other than that, I don't really
have too many examples. Now we may

549
00:48:31.960 --> 00:48:35.599
throw that at the end, but
we'd go through a long list of all

550
00:48:35.639 --> 00:48:39.400
the things we Look, we always
say, pray, pray, pray because

551
00:48:39.440 --> 00:48:44.039
we God can intervene. Look,
our belief is that God will intervene,

552
00:48:44.119 --> 00:48:47.719
God will do something. That's I
mean, Christianity is built on that premise.

553
00:48:50.840 --> 00:48:53.559
But is it built on a fraudulent
premiss If we're really supposed to be

554
00:48:53.639 --> 00:48:58.400
going to God saying God, your
will be done in the end, I

555
00:48:58.400 --> 00:49:01.400
don't need to say anything else.
Hey, Hey, look, so and

556
00:49:01.440 --> 00:49:05.079
so they just got rushed to the
hospital. Will you pray? Sure,

557
00:49:05.559 --> 00:49:07.039
God, your will be done?
I mean it's gonna be done anyway,

558
00:49:07.079 --> 00:49:12.519
but sure, I'll pray for you. I don't really know why you want

559
00:49:12.559 --> 00:49:15.840
me to pray, but yeah I
can. I can say God's will be

560
00:49:15.880 --> 00:49:22.119
done. It's immutable, it's unchangeable, it's infallible, but sure I'll pray

561
00:49:22.159 --> 00:49:23.880
that his No, I don't want
you to pray that his will be done.

562
00:49:23.960 --> 00:49:28.159
I want you to pray that my
loved one is healed, my loved

563
00:49:28.159 --> 00:49:31.239
one is saved. But I can
I pray that. I mean, I

564
00:49:31.239 --> 00:49:36.159
guess I can. But if we
really believe his will is unchangeable, what

565
00:49:36.280 --> 00:49:43.840
is it going to change? Absolutely
nothing? And nobody wants to hear that.

566
00:49:45.920 --> 00:49:53.119
So how do you think Ai wrote
the prayer? You ready? All

567
00:49:53.159 --> 00:49:57.320
right? Here's what Ai told me. Here's an example of a prayer from

568
00:49:57.320 --> 00:50:01.000
a reformed Calvinistic perspective during a time
of tragedy or great suffering. This is

569
00:50:01.000 --> 00:50:06.840
how Ai wrote the prayer. Heavenly
Father, we come before you in our

570
00:50:06.840 --> 00:50:12.639
time of sorrow and distress. Acknowledging
your sovereign hand over all things. We

571
00:50:12.719 --> 00:50:15.559
confess that we do not fully understand
the reasons for the pain and suffering we

572
00:50:15.599 --> 00:50:22.360
are experiencing, but we trust in
your perfect wisdom and goodness. Lord.

573
00:50:22.400 --> 00:50:25.360
We ask for your comfort and strength
in the midst of our trials. Help

574
00:50:25.440 --> 00:50:30.119
us to find peace and the knowledge
that you are in control and that nothing

575
00:50:30.199 --> 00:50:35.400
happens outside of your divine will.
Grant us the grace to endure this hardship

576
00:50:35.440 --> 00:50:39.039
with faith, knowing that you work
all things together for good for those who

577
00:50:39.079 --> 00:50:43.639
love you and are called according to
your purpose. Father, we pray that

578
00:50:43.679 --> 00:50:45.719
you would use this time of suffering
to draw us closer to you, to

579
00:50:45.760 --> 00:50:50.679
deepen our dependence on your provision,
and to refine our character to be more

580
00:50:50.760 --> 00:50:53.679
like Christ. Help us to see
your hand at work even in our pain,

581
00:50:54.000 --> 00:50:58.840
and trust that we are accomplished.
That we are accomplishing your purpose in

582
00:50:59.039 --> 00:51:04.559
and through us. We also asked
that you would be glorified through our response

583
00:51:04.639 --> 00:51:07.719
to this tragedy. May our faith
hopeing you be a testimony to others of

584
00:51:07.760 --> 00:51:13.239
your unchanging love and faithfulness. Use
our suffering to bring others to a saving

585
00:51:13.280 --> 00:51:15.960
knowledge of Christ. And all things
we submit to your will, knowing that

586
00:51:16.000 --> 00:51:20.280
you are a loving, a compassionate
God who is always with us. We

587
00:51:20.360 --> 00:51:22.880
pray this in the name of our
Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. Amen.

588
00:51:25.519 --> 00:51:30.000
I was like AI can pray better
than most people. I'm like man,

589
00:51:30.480 --> 00:51:31.800
I need AI to write all my
prayers. I'm just gonna go to

590
00:51:31.840 --> 00:51:34.800
AI every day. Hey, I
don't know what to pray. Can you

591
00:51:34.840 --> 00:51:38.880
help me? Does that not sound
really good? What is that prayer filled

592
00:51:38.920 --> 00:51:47.320
with your sovereign were not and didn't
really didn't ask God to change what one

593
00:51:47.360 --> 00:51:55.360
thing other than allow the suffering to
change us for his glory, and that

594
00:51:55.519 --> 00:52:04.800
his purpose even in suffering, works
through us. Wow, that I don't

595
00:52:04.800 --> 00:52:07.679
know. I was like, well, it's easy for you to say AI,

596
00:52:07.960 --> 00:52:09.519
right, Okay, it's easy for
you to talk that way because you're

597
00:52:09.519 --> 00:52:14.719
not suffering anything. Hey, come
on, AI, let you suffer something

598
00:52:14.719 --> 00:52:16.440
and see if you can pray that
way. It's easy to when you're you're

599
00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:20.400
not connected to it. Right.
If someone I don't know come to me

600
00:52:20.440 --> 00:52:22.119
and go, hey, this horrible
tragedy happened to my family, Well,

601
00:52:22.159 --> 00:52:27.920
let me offer a very AI sovereign
type of prayer. Okay, it will

602
00:52:27.960 --> 00:52:30.960
be so good. Right, But
if it's your own family, you're like,

603
00:52:30.000 --> 00:52:34.719
you know, forget this trash,
God, do something? Why are

604
00:52:34.719 --> 00:52:43.360
you not I'm gonna sound like some
eighty three? Correct? That does not

605
00:52:43.440 --> 00:52:51.639
sound like Psal maybe three, does
it? Now? This is the inevitable

606
00:52:52.239 --> 00:53:00.239
contradiction between prayer and theology. Everyone
often says that many Calvinists pray like they're

607
00:53:00.280 --> 00:53:06.559
not a Calvinist. In some circumstances, many non Calvinist when it comes to

608
00:53:06.559 --> 00:53:13.360
praying for salvation for their loved ones, pray as if they are a Calvinist.

609
00:53:14.519 --> 00:53:20.599
Because what typically guides our prayer more
than our theology, our emotions,

610
00:53:20.639 --> 00:53:23.360
feelings, need, and desire.
So if you, even though you believe

611
00:53:23.360 --> 00:53:27.599
in man's complete free will, when
you pray for someone salvation, what do

612
00:53:27.639 --> 00:53:30.519
you pray? God? Save them, God break them, God draw them?

613
00:53:30.559 --> 00:53:34.519
Who whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa.
God can't do anything to interfere with

614
00:53:34.519 --> 00:53:37.679
their free will if you truly believe
in free will. And as a Calvinist,

615
00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:40.000
when we pray for salvation, we're
like, God, bring those whom

616
00:53:40.000 --> 00:53:44.599
you've chosen before the foundations of the
world to faith. But when it comes

617
00:53:44.599 --> 00:53:46.199
to tragedy, how do we then
all of a sudden the pray as more

618
00:53:46.199 --> 00:53:50.840
calvinistic approach. God, do this
and do this, And we don't say,

619
00:53:50.880 --> 00:53:55.440
God, this is your immutable,
infallible, eternal decree working out in

620
00:53:55.519 --> 00:54:00.800
real time, and I submit to
it and I praise to you for it,

621
00:54:00.000 --> 00:54:05.480
even though that means my daughter is
three minutes away from dying. No,

622
00:54:05.480 --> 00:54:08.960
no, no, we don't pray
that way, do we, Which

623
00:54:09.000 --> 00:54:14.960
means sometimes what guides the Christian life. Is not theology, it never has

624
00:54:15.000 --> 00:54:21.400
been theology. It's our own mind
forming and shaping God into an image which

625
00:54:21.440 --> 00:54:34.199
we can control and guide. A. I didn't Ai told me this.

626
00:54:34.199 --> 00:54:37.920
This prayer reflects the Reformed emphasis on
God's sovereignty, the purpose of suffering and

627
00:54:37.960 --> 00:54:43.440
the believer's life and the ultimate aim
of glorified God, glorify, glorifying God

628
00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:47.679
through all circumstances. And I'm like, well, thank you so much,

629
00:54:50.519 --> 00:54:55.559
mister or missus Ai. It is
a very well written prayer, is it

630
00:54:55.599 --> 00:54:59.880
not? I mean, because but
why why is it so well constructed?

631
00:55:00.760 --> 00:55:05.480
Well? Because AI has no emotion? What can AI do? Take the

632
00:55:05.480 --> 00:55:12.480
theology and then draw a logical inference
from what that theology would sound like in

633
00:55:12.519 --> 00:55:16.280
prayer? And immediately I am confronted
that I would not pray like that,

634
00:55:16.559 --> 00:55:24.679
which immediately demonstrates what is not guiding
my prayer life theology. Oh, come

635
00:55:24.719 --> 00:55:28.360
on, I can't. We're all
on the same boat, are we not.

636
00:55:32.159 --> 00:55:39.079
Now, when we look at PSAW
eighty three, now it's a lament.

637
00:55:40.760 --> 00:55:44.559
Now if it's just a lament,
if we really put in that category,

638
00:55:44.760 --> 00:55:46.840
there is a prayer portion of lament. But it's mainly crying out to

639
00:55:46.840 --> 00:55:55.559
God, expressing why. What's a
lament primarily doing expressing emotion? Lament expresses

640
00:55:55.599 --> 00:56:00.760
emotion to God. It's not necessarily
going to be guided by what theology.

641
00:56:01.760 --> 00:56:06.920
And there's an appropriate time for our
emotion to be cried out to God.

642
00:56:06.960 --> 00:56:09.880
We know that right the reason there
has to be an appropriate time. We

643
00:56:10.039 --> 00:56:14.760
just know of the psychological damage because
if you if you can't be honest with

644
00:56:14.800 --> 00:56:16.639
God, you have to continue.
Your Christian life is based upon a lie,

645
00:56:16.840 --> 00:56:20.760
and you have to pretend and pretend
and pretend, and you can only

646
00:56:20.800 --> 00:56:27.920
pretend until it doesn't work anymore.
It doesn't work anymore. That falls apart.

647
00:56:29.039 --> 00:56:32.840
It just that falls apart, and
we're gonna have to stop. But

648
00:56:32.920 --> 00:56:37.280
you know, there was someone well
I worked, someone worked for me who

649
00:56:37.840 --> 00:56:42.360
went to New Hope and she was
friends with a guy. His name was

650
00:56:42.360 --> 00:56:46.079
Taylor who he at one point worked
at New Hope. Well, New Hope

651
00:56:46.119 --> 00:56:50.880
is charismatic church, as everyone knows, right, Well, his father got

652
00:56:51.360 --> 00:56:57.679
horribly sick. Well that's a charismatic
church. So the charismatic church told him

653
00:56:57.719 --> 00:57:01.800
that it was God's will that for
his father to be healed, and then

654
00:57:02.119 --> 00:57:08.320
gave prophetic knowledge that his father would
be healed. And guess what happened to

655
00:57:08.400 --> 00:57:17.440
his father died? And guess what
happened to that man? Well, he

656
00:57:17.639 --> 00:57:22.519
left New Hope. Let's just say
that. Now a lot of other bad

657
00:57:22.559 --> 00:57:24.280
things happened after that, but we
will go into all that. But the

658
00:57:24.280 --> 00:57:34.119
point was, finally his theology was
confronted with what reality. Our theology about

659
00:57:34.159 --> 00:57:39.440
God is always confronted with what reality. And this is what many in the

660
00:57:39.480 --> 00:57:44.440
world are pointing out that Christians sound
like ridiculous people when they look at these

661
00:57:44.480 --> 00:57:46.159
situations and we're like God, this
God then and they're like, well,

662
00:57:46.159 --> 00:57:50.360
where was your God when this was
happening? Or this was happening, this

663
00:57:50.519 --> 00:57:53.719
was happening and Christians and what Christians
do when they get when they get that

664
00:57:53.800 --> 00:57:58.400
thrown in their face, they get
defensive, do they not? And what's

665
00:57:58.400 --> 00:58:01.559
typically the answer? Well, well, I mean, I mean, uh,

666
00:58:01.719 --> 00:58:05.719
Satan does this, and Satan they
immediately want to start blaming Satan.

667
00:58:05.719 --> 00:58:07.119
They're like, well, didn't hear
God create Satan? Well, well,

668
00:58:07.199 --> 00:58:09.559
well, I mean, I mean, but God, but God, free

669
00:58:09.599 --> 00:58:13.960
will, free will, free will. God, God can't do anything about

670
00:58:14.000 --> 00:58:15.360
free will. God can't do anything
about free will. Well, if he

671
00:58:15.480 --> 00:58:19.880
was all worried about free will,
he wouldn't have messed up the shooters shot

672
00:58:20.039 --> 00:58:23.440
to save Trump because that's interfering with
that person's will. That person wanted Trump

673
00:58:23.480 --> 00:58:28.239
dead. So why did God get
involved? Well, well, it's not

674
00:58:28.320 --> 00:58:31.599
free will. You're just an atheist, okay, Well or maybe I don't

675
00:58:31.599 --> 00:58:35.800
know. I've got two brain cells
and I can think the problems this this

676
00:58:36.039 --> 00:58:39.599
that everyone else should see. Like, stop yelling at people for being an

677
00:58:39.639 --> 00:58:46.880
atheist because you don't like the questions. Antheists did not create the questions.

678
00:58:47.159 --> 00:58:53.960
You know what creates the questions.
Nobody's gonna like this the existence of an

679
00:58:53.960 --> 00:58:59.800
all knowing, all powerful God that's
gonna raise questions when you look at a

680
00:58:59.840 --> 00:59:05.079
world that calls in the question that
God has That not been my entire point

681
00:59:05.079 --> 00:59:12.199
I've made in Saw maybe three now
five hundred times. Yes, all right,

682
00:59:12.519 --> 00:59:16.800
we'll have to stop there, because
up next there's the Armenian perspective.

683
00:59:20.679 --> 00:59:22.760
I should have asked. I don't
know what. I don't think I asked

684
00:59:22.760 --> 00:59:24.880
AI to write a prayer from an
army an Armenian perspective, but I think

685
00:59:24.880 --> 00:59:31.440
we know what those prayers sound like
because everyone when facing tragedy praise either like

686
00:59:31.480 --> 00:59:38.719
an open theist or an Armenian,
our Calvinism, our our, our belief

687
00:59:38.719 --> 00:59:43.559
in the sovereignty of God crumbles in
the face of difficulty. It just falls

688
00:59:43.559 --> 00:59:50.440
apart. Now we it helps us
maybe understand well, okay, God has

689
00:59:50.440 --> 00:59:52.760
a purpose and plan in it,
but we have a hard time just say

690
00:59:52.840 --> 00:59:55.760
well, then, I'm just going
to accept to God God's unchangeable will,

691
00:59:55.960 --> 01:00:00.400
right, because we believe it's changeable. To some level, we believe it's

692
01:00:00.480 --> 01:00:04.920
changeable. I mean, what if
people always say about prayer. Come on,

693
01:00:05.280 --> 01:00:07.159
you've heard it said on Christian radio. You've heard all your Christian friends

694
01:00:07.199 --> 01:00:10.960
say it. In fact, many
churches have it on their website or anywhere.

695
01:00:12.079 --> 01:00:14.960
You know, Hey, this Wednesday
night, we're having a prayer meeting

696
01:00:14.960 --> 01:00:22.440
because prayer changes things. Right,
Ask any if you're Christian friends, what

697
01:00:22.599 --> 01:00:28.119
is wrong with this statement? Prayer
changes things? And they will all say

698
01:00:28.239 --> 01:00:32.159
there's nothing wrong with it. Well, it would seem that there's one thing

699
01:00:32.199 --> 01:00:38.599
prayer can't change, which is what
God's unchangeable will. And he said,

700
01:00:38.599 --> 01:00:43.679
well, what is God's will?
According to the London Baptist in Westminster,

701
01:00:44.480 --> 01:00:49.440
what's whoever comes to pass. All
right, that's troubling. Nobody's gonna like

702
01:00:49.519 --> 01:00:52.239
that. Don't go home and tell
anybody you learned that. Well, if

703
01:00:52.440 --> 01:00:55.400
they already know you go to a
ridiculous church. But don't tell most of

704
01:00:55.440 --> 01:01:00.360
your Christian friends because you will no
longer be Christian friends with them. They'll

705
01:01:00.360 --> 01:01:04.480
get very offended and very mad and
think you're a lunatic, but they won't

706
01:01:04.519 --> 01:01:07.159
deal with the reality these questions.
Everyone should have to. When you read

707
01:01:07.199 --> 01:01:09.880
Saw eighty three, that should be
the first thing that comes to why are

708
01:01:09.920 --> 01:01:16.679
you praying to the God who's allowing
all this to happen? But we never

709
01:01:16.760 --> 01:01:23.960
asked that question, do we correct? I think it's one thing. I

710
01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:29.880
could be wrong, but I think
if you read the entire story of Joseph,

711
01:01:30.039 --> 01:01:31.960
I could be wrong. I don't
think anytime he's in one of those

712
01:01:31.960 --> 01:01:37.360
situations there's any record of him praying
for God to change it. I could

713
01:01:37.360 --> 01:01:42.280
be wrong. When he goes to
prison, he's just doing his thing,

714
01:01:42.559 --> 01:01:50.079
right, I don't tae a prayer
of him, right, yeah, yeah,

715
01:01:50.239 --> 01:01:52.519
yeah, I tell the King.
I don't know. But I mean,

716
01:01:52.519 --> 01:01:54.639
if that's the case, that's fascinating
that he never really prays for God

717
01:01:54.679 --> 01:01:59.880
to do anything. But at the
end, what is he say? You

718
01:02:00.199 --> 01:02:04.360
intended for evil? God intended?
So he kind of saw that God was

719
01:02:04.400 --> 01:02:07.440
involved in all of it. One
of the beautiful things I love about Job

720
01:02:07.559 --> 01:02:13.000
is Job ask God a lot of
questions. But guess what, Job never

721
01:02:13.480 --> 01:02:16.960
does. He never denies that the
tragedy he is facing doesn't come from God.

722
01:02:19.239 --> 01:02:22.119
In fact, he says it comes
from What did he tell his wife

723
01:02:23.639 --> 01:02:28.039
when she said curse God and die? What did he tell her? Does

724
01:02:28.079 --> 01:02:31.639
everybody know what Job told her?
Should we not accept? If we're going

725
01:02:31.679 --> 01:02:36.639
to accept good from God, we
have to also accept that which is basically

726
01:02:36.639 --> 01:02:43.079
bad. I'm paraphrasing. So Job
constantly understood that all the suffering came from

727
01:02:43.119 --> 01:02:51.800
whom God, And Job doesn't do
a lot about asking God to change it.

728
01:02:51.880 --> 01:02:55.039
He moreph is upset with God.
He almost just wants God to do

729
01:02:55.119 --> 01:03:05.360
what kill him now? But I
can find other stories where they seem to

730
01:03:05.360 --> 01:03:08.320
clearly ask God to change it.
So I I I don't know how you

731
01:03:08.320 --> 01:03:12.239
interpret that? All right, let's
pray, Lord, Lord God, we

732
01:03:12.280 --> 01:03:17.480
come before you this morning. Lord. We are confronted with a reality that

733
01:03:17.559 --> 01:03:28.400
you are God, and we don't
understand we are at times left confused and

734
01:03:28.519 --> 01:03:34.719
perplexed by looking into your sovereignty and
your attributes. God, just allow us,

735
01:03:35.800 --> 01:03:40.960
help us somehow accept what we cannot
understand, because Lord, at times

736
01:03:42.119 --> 01:03:45.280
is very overwhelming. And we asked
this in the precious end of Jesus,

737
01:03:45.280 --> 01:03:49.039
and God's people said