Oct. 3, 2024

Heart, Nature, and Sin

Heart, Nature, and Sin

We try another dissection of a Christian body

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We try another dissection of a Christian body

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Looking at our world from a theological perspective. This is

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the Theology Central podcast, making Theology Central. This is Patrol one.

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Come in Headquarters, Headquarters. This is Patrol one. Please come in,

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Patrol one. This is headquarters. You've now called us like

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five hundred times. We understand, we know that you're at

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First Baptist Church. You've made this horrible discovery. You have

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found three hundred dead bodies, and you keep calling us

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asking us what to do. Well, we don't know what

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to do anymore. We've tried everything. We don't know. We've

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told you to do this, We've told you to do this,

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and you're still there. We told you to leave. Just

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move on. Look, there are the three hundred dead bodies

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there in the church. Just leave, just move on. We

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don't have any answers for you. I don't have any

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answers for you. Yes, we have been using that illustration

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now over and over and over, and at this point

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in the illustration, Yes, headquarters is fed up. They don't

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know what to do. But today, well we're gonna try

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something else. Today we are going to tell Patrol one. Hey,

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Patrol one, this is headquarters. Look we we and around

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about way we've just been sitting here making fun of

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you as you continue to try all of these things

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to fix these three hundred dead bodies. But today we've

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got something for you. We want you to turn to

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Psal oneh eight and bring in more surgical equipment. Yeah,

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that's good. Read Psalm one oh eight, verse one, bring

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in surgical equipment, and we well, we're gonna have you

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dissect some more dead bodies. That's what we're going to do,

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all right, That's that's what we're going to do. I know,

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does that make any sense. It doesn't make any sense.

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None of this makes any sense. But let me try

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to get everyone caught up, because this is going to

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take kind of a strange turn. So let me try

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to explain where we have been and where we are going.

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All right. We have been talking now for a very

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long time about a reality that I believe most Christians

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are unwilling to acknowledge, and that is this these facts right,

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more than just one, there's a number of facts that

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I think, I know Christianity will play lip service to it,

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but I don't think they really know how to process

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this in reality. And that is this, as a believer,

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as Christians, we cannot keep God's law as a believer,

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you cannot keep God's law. I can demonstrate that again

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and again and again. The Bible says, be ye, holy

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as He is holy. That is a command you cannot keep.

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That you never will keep. That. That means every Christian

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is in a perpetual state of sin. You are sinning

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continually because you are falling short. You are missing the

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mark of what God demands, which is perfection. Hate demands

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perfection internally, Hate demands perfection externally. You never meet that.

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You are in a perpetual state of sin. But somehow

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Christians almost forget that and say, well, okay, wait, so

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everyone's in a state of sin. But but bye bye bye,

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that's the sin or that's the sin and and the

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we'll go after that sin and not go wait a minute,

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all of us are sinners and we're in a perpetual

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state of sin. How do we understand that? And the

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reason Christians struggle with how to handle that is because

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we spend most of our time making these claims that

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if you know, you've heard this a million times, if

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you are in Christ, you are a new creature. Old

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things are passed away, All things have become new, and

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it's taught that is taught as being a practical reality

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versus a positional reality. But if we are all new creatures,

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the old is gone in everything, thing is new, then

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there would be no sin to fight, there would be

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no we would be perfect. But no, no, no, somehow

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we are a new creature, the old is gone, but

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yet we're still fighting sin. Supposedly we have a new heart,

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we have a new nature, we have a new everything,

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yet we continue to sin, and so it gets really confusing.

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So we've been talking about it. I'm not gonna go,

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you know, you can go listen to everything we've been

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talking about for the last few weeks. We've been talking

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about it over and over and over, and so then

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we I stumbled upon We kind of looked at how

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Lordship would try to approach this, and Lordship basically just says, hey,

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you're not saved. You're not safe. You're not safe, you're

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not saved. You're not saved. You're not saved, you're not saved.

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You're not saying we don't know if anyone is saved

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except we, Well, of course we are saved, but everyone

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else is probably not. And so we kind of we

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looked at that and we didn't feel that that did

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a very good job. And then I stumbled upon a

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book entitled Six Secrets of the Christian Life. Six Secrets

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of the Christian Life. Now the reasons I told everyone

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about this book. It's cheap four dollars for a physical copy,

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three dollars for the kindle, and it approached the subject

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from supposedly somewhat of a unique way, and it's stated

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that here is the situation. Let me break this down

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to you. Most of you now know this by heart,

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that the Christian body is dead. Our physical body is dead.

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You know what does that mean that our physical body

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is dead? Well, just stay with me. Number one, the

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physical body is dead. The Christian body is dead. Number two,

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the nature and heart of a Christian is completely transformed.

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It is completely changed. It is sinless. So inside you're

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completely sinless, meaning that wherever sin is coming from, it's

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not really coming from inside the house, right, because everything

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inside the house is supposedly clean. So where is sin

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coming from? Well, this is where it gets confusing, right,

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are you ready? So the Christian body is dead, the

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nature and heart is completely transformed, but the body cannot

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respond to the new nature. So their argument is, here's

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the problem. You're completely transformed on the inside, but your

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body is dead, and therefore it can't respond to the

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new nature. The new nature wants to do right, but

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the body just sits there. There's nothing that can get

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the body to move, to operate, to work, to do

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what is right. So their argument was, the body needs

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a resurrection, and not a resurrection and glorification, but a

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resurrection now here on this earth. We've got to get

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the body resurrected. And once the body is resurrected, well,

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then the body can respond to the nature. Now, they

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literally just walk into the same problem. Right, once my

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body is resurrected, and if my nature is completely transformed,

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well then ladies and gentlemen, we should be able to

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be perfect because we would have a body that now

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can respond to all the perfection that is inside. Therefore

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we should be sinless. They don't address that. They just

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then start writing chapters trying to explain how we can

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somehow get the body resurrected. And those chapters have been

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confounding and confusing and make no sense because they almost backtrack.

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You need a resurrection, and then it turns into well,

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you don't really get a resurrection. What you need is

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some kind of progressive transformation, but that would not be

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a resurrection. And it just got confusing. It just got confusing.

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So in the midst of trying to figure all of

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that out, we got into this discussion. All right, So,

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when when you listen to Christians teach, they sometimes will

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talk about a new heart and a new nature. So

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is the heart and nature different? Are they the same?

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And if the heart and nature is different and change,

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then where does sin come from? Well some try to

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say it's like leftover sin. But where is the leftover

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sin at. It's not in a new heart, it's not

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in an new nature. So then they try to say

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that this leftover sin is in the body. You're like,

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so the body, the leftover sin in the body is

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stronger than the new nature and a new heart because

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the new nature and a new heart cannot get me

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to perfection. So leftover sin. That gets all confounding and confusing.

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So we've just been through all of this, and so

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then I became very frustrated, very irritated by this entire discussion,

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and we reviewed a lot of sermons, and some of

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the sermons we reviewed just were maddening, nonsensical, contradictory statements.

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On one hand, basically, you're perfect, but you can't be perfect.

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You're sinless, but you can't be sinless, and just all

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of this really confounding, confusing things. So I decided yesterday

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I'm done. I'm done with this. I've got I've got

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to do something different. I've got it. I got to

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find a way to pull myself out of this like

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pit we've fallen in because I'm going to lose my mind.

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So I grabbed the Sermon's two point oh app. Remember

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twenty twenty four, it's the Sermon's two point oh app

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sermon Challenge. Every one day, every single day, you're to

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listen to a random sermon on the Sermon's two point

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oh app. She's supposed to be keeping a notebook, and

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by the end of this year, you should have one

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sermon for every day of the year, right, and you're

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supposed to write a very simple summary of every sermon

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you've listened to. So I'm like, okay, I'll go to that.

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So I looked on the Sermon's two point oh app.

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I went to newest sermons, and the first one I

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found was on Psalm one oh eight. All right. We

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only reviewed, like, I know, three minutes of it, four

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minutes of it, and then I backtracked and went and

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covered the historical context that some went away as a

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combination of two parts of two different psalms. We looked

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at the historical context of those psalms, and then they

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made a kind of a crazy statement that David's heart

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was immutable, and I was like, what is this? So

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we kind of took that apart. So then this morning

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I was like, okay, what do we do? What do

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we do? What do we do? And I'm like, oh,

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I'm gonna go back to Psalm oneh eight, all right,

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I'm gonna read it from two different translations, some one

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towight verse one, oh God, my heart is fixed, Oh God,

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my heart is fixed, and a different translation it reads

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so I want to wait verse one, Oh God, my

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heart is stead fast. My heart is fixed, My heart

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is stead fast. So then I I got everything ready.

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I opened up the dashboard and I put in the

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metadata a fixed and steadfast heart. I had like five

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pages of notes. I was gonna look, what does it

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mean to have a fixed and stead fast heart? And

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where else does this concept concept appear in scripture? I

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was gonna go through all the script and talked about, hey,

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do you have a fixed and steadfast heart today? What

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does that mean? What does that look like? Let's consider

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it right, and we were going to have kind of

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a devotional message and it would get us far, far

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far away from Patrol one calling headquarters about three hundred

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dead bodies, and first Baptist Church. It was going to

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get us away from all of that discussion. Then I

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made a mistake. I was like, well, if I'm going

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to break this down before we get to fixed, before

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we get to stead fast, both translations King James, New

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King James starts with oh God, my heart, the New

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King James, Oh God, my heart. So it starts with

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the heart before it gets to the fixed or stead fast.

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It begins with the heart. So then I was like, well,

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let's start right there. We have to define what does

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the pummist mean, what does the sawmist mean when he

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uses the term heart? We need to talk about the heart.

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And as soon as I started working on the definition

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and meaning of the heart, well, we ended up right

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back to what we've been discussing sin. Where does sin

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come from? What is the actual makeup of a Christian?

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Do we have a new heart old heart? Do we

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have a new heart but an old nature? Is nature

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and heart synonymous? Are they different? How does this work?

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And so I'm like, oh boy, we've fallen right back

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into this. So what we're going to do is we're

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going to discuss what the heart is, how does that

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relate to the concept of nature? And then how do

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we understand that many Christians claim we have a new

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heart and new soul, a new heart and a new nature.

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While there are some, they are in the minority of

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the minority of the minority they would be. And my

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philological camp, no, no, no, no, no no, we do

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not practically have a new heart and a new nature.

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Positionally we are new, but not practically. That's why we

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still sin. So we're gonna look at some different streams

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of theology, but we're just gonna get into trying to

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We're gonna dissect. So what we're going to do is

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we're some one O eight is gonna get us to say, hey,

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the heart we need, we need to open up some

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Christian dead bodies and get back into seeing the makeup

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of a Christian and let's start with the heart. Then

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we'll consider the nature and how the nature relates to

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the concept of the heart, same or different. Then we'll

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look at well the different Christian theologies and how they

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understand a new heart, new new new nature and those

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types of things. Are you ready? So that's I know

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it's a long and winding road, but that's how we

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end up kind of back right here today. I know

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what I basically did is I crawled out of the pit,

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said let's look at some one o eight, and now

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I'm just crawling right back down into the pit, going, well,

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let's let's go back and deal with this subject. So

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are you ready? All right? In the Salmon in the Psalms,

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In the Psalms, when whenever a ssawmist, whenever a writer

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of the Psalms mentions the word heart, the term, obviously,

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I think we can all agree with this refers more

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to then just the physical organ. We know it's not

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just it's not referencing the physical heart. We know that

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physical heart's just pumping blood through the body. Right, We

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know that it's not referring to that. Everyone knows that.

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That's easy. You don't need a Bible college. You don't

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need seminary. Everyone knows when it refers to the heart,

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it's referring to something more. All right. In Biblical language,

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especially in Hebrew, the heart is understood as the center

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of a person's inner life. It encompasses the mind, the will, emotions,

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and moral character. Oh wow, so now this gets really

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this gets really confounding. Right, this is gonna get a

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little confusing because a lot of times we separate the

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mind from the heart. But at least in Hebrew language

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and Hebrew thought, right, the heart is the center of

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a person's inner life. It encompasses the mind, the will,

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the emotions, and moral character. It represents the core of

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a person's being, where decisions are made, thoughts are formed,

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and feelings are experienced. This is like the essence of

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who we are. Now, I will just I'm just gonna

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go ahead and make an argument here, a theological argument.

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This is why those who believe in free will have

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to be a Pallagian. They have to believe that we're

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not totally depraved. You can't. I know, I've been in

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plenty of churches. We believe in total depravity. We believe

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that people are sinners. Yeah, we believe in free will

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makes no sense because if the heart is depraved, the

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heart encompasses the will, so the will would not be

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free because it's a depraved heart. So the will cannot

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just then freely choose God because the will is depraved,

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so it will never choose God. It will always choose opposite. Now,

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I will make an argument, all right, if a Christian

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has a new heart and that encompasses the will, then

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we should be able to freely choose to never sin again,

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and we should be able to accomplish that. If we

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cannot freely choose to never sin again and we're going

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to continue to sin, then maybe we don't have a

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new heart, as all Christians tend to claim by usually missupplying, misinterpreting,

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and doing some really bad hermeneutics to Ezekuel thirty six.

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But we won't go there right now. I just want

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you to hear it again. According to at least some

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understanding that within Hebrew thought and Hebrew language, the word

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heart is understood as the center of a person's inner life,

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encompassing their mind, their will, their emotions, and their moral character.

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It represents the core of a person's being where decisions

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are made thoughts are formed and feelings are experienced. This

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would be all of us, all right. So let's look

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as specific aspects of the heart in the Psalms. Let's

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kind of take a journey and see how maybe specific

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psalms would understand certain things. All right, So within the psalms,

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the heart in the Psalms often refers to a person's thoughts, understanding,

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or intellect. In this sense, it functions similarly to what

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we might call the mind today. Now this is going

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to get really confusing. So even the mind, at least

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in the Psalms, the heart would encompass that what we

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would call the mind, the Psalmist would call the heart.

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Look at Psal nineteen. Now we may get into some

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translation issues here, but I'll use multiple if we need to.

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We'll look at different translations and see how they handle this.

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I hope we don't get into too much of a

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translation textual issue here, but we will see Psalm nineteen.

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Look at verse fourteen. Let the words of my mouth,

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all right, there we go, Psalm nineteen fourteen. Let the

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words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart

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be acceptable in thy sight, Oh Lord, my strength and

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my redeemer. Now The idea here is that the heart

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and the Psalms refers to a person's thoughts, understanding, or intellect,

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and the sense it functions, similarly to what we might

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call the mind. Today, may the words of my mouth

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and the meditation of my heart be pleasing in your sight,

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Oh Lord, my Rock and my redeemer. Here the meditation

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of my heart refers to the inner thoughts and reflections

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of the summus. Now you could argue, I don't know

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if I don't know if I like this one, but

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typically we think of meditation referring to in the mind.

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Their argument is the meditation encompasses the heart, which is

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encompasses all of us, including the mind, so to meditate

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from a Their arguing argument from Psalm's Psalm nineteen fourteen

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is that the heart encompasses not only the thinking, the meditating,

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the what we say our mind, but it encompasses the

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entire being, So we are to meditate on the word

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from it all of us. Let let the words of

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my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable

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in thy sight. That our meditation should encompass every bit

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of us, and the heart represents all of us, the will,

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the emotion, the intellect every aspect that the that the

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heart represents the mind just as well, because when we

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think of meditating, we encamp. We always think of the mind, right,

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we meditate, we think on it. We But they're saying, well,

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the use of heart here shows that encompasses much more,

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all right. So the heart is the within within the sawmist.

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It is the seat of thought and understanding. So their

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argument is, when we consider the heart and the Psalms,

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it's the seat of thought and understanding. How about number two?

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According to some, the heart as used in the Psalms

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is also the center of emotion and feeling. So it's

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the seed of thought and understanding, but it's also the

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center of emotion and feelings. The heart also refers to

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a person's emotions joy, sorrow, fear, and love. The Psalm

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has frequently expressed as feelings like gladness, anguish, and grief

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in the heart. Look at Psalm thirteen. Psalm thirteen, Psalm

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thirteen to two, how long shall I take counsel in

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my soul? Having sorrow in my heart daily? So the

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heart here is also the center of emotions and feelings

349
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in this case, and ps I'm thirteen two the Psalmist

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heart is weighed down with sorrow, reflecting emotional turmoil. Look

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at Psalm sixteen nine. Therefore my heart is glad se

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Psalms sixteen nine, therefore my heart is glad. Here the

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heart is associated with joy and happiness, showing the emotional

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response to God's protection and presence. So according to this

355
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in the Psalm, the heart is the seat right. It

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00:22:32.480 --> 00:22:35.759
is the seat of thought and understanding, and it is

357
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the center of emotions and feelings. So I want you

358
00:22:41.319 --> 00:22:45.960
to think about that. In the Psalms, the Psalmist clearly

359
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indicates that the heart is the seat of thought and understanding,

360
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and it is the center of emotions and feelings. How

361
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about number three? The heart is also the center of

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will and decision making. It is also the center of

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the will and decision making, and many passages the heart

364
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represents the will where decisions and choices are made. To

365
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have a steadfast heart, like in Psalm one eight one

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is to have a firm, determined will fixed on following

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and trusting God. And then it says psal Well, we

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can look at Psalm one nineteen one twelve Psalm one

369
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nineteen one twelve, where we read this I have inclined

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my heart to perform thy statutes alway, even onto the end.

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The Psalmist expressed as a deliberate choice or intention to

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obey God, with the heart being the source of that decision.

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So the heart here is connected to the will. Now

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I think we can incline our heart to do it.

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We're never going to do it. I think that once again. Well,

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we can demonstrate that over and over and over and over.

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But the heart is where the inclination, the decision is

378
00:24:10.640 --> 00:24:15.079
being made. It's within the heart, which is the will.

379
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That's the part the point here, right. So what is

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the heart or what is the heart associated with? Well,

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the heart is the seat of thought and understanding. It

382
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is the center of emotion and feelings, and is the

383
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center of will and decision making. But it is also

384
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the moral and spiritual core. The heart is also seen

385
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as the moral center of a person, where purity or

386
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impurity resides. It's often depicted as the place from which

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either sin or righteousness flows, depending on the state of

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the heart. Now, I think this is key, right. If

389
00:24:55.519 --> 00:24:58.799
the heart is the moral and spiritual center from which

390
00:24:59.319 --> 00:25:04.799
sin or righteousness flows, then this is key. Whenever we

391
00:25:04.920 --> 00:25:07.480
talk about ongoing sin in the life of a believer.

392
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Where is it a coming from Well, Christians want to say,

393
00:25:11.279 --> 00:25:13.720
it's not coming from the heart, and I will argue, yes,

394
00:25:13.960 --> 00:25:18.279
it is. The heart is still sinful, it's still depraved.

395
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That's why we still sin. Now. Of course, whenever we

396
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talk about the heart and sin, remember the famous confession

397
00:25:29.000 --> 00:25:37.240
of David Right. David had committed horrible sin. Right, we

398
00:25:37.319 --> 00:25:41.200
have adultery, we have murder. Right, And then what does

399
00:25:41.440 --> 00:25:46.599
David say in Psalm fifty one ten, Create in me

400
00:25:47.640 --> 00:25:52.759
a clean heart, Oh God, Create in me a clean heart,

401
00:25:52.839 --> 00:25:55.079
Oh God. Why is he asking for a clean heart?

402
00:25:55.319 --> 00:25:59.799
Because he knows his sin is originating from inside of

403
00:26:00.240 --> 00:26:04.839
him and he needs a clean heart. That is, it's

404
00:26:04.920 --> 00:26:07.920
more of an acknowledgement of where his sin is is

405
00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:14.559
arising from. It's coming from within. So it's the moral

406
00:26:14.559 --> 00:26:21.720
and central core a Psalm twenty four to four. He

407
00:26:21.839 --> 00:26:25.680
hath clean, he that hath clean hands and a pure heart,

408
00:26:25.920 --> 00:26:28.680
who hath not lifted up his soul and divanity, nor

409
00:26:28.799 --> 00:26:33.200
sworn deceitful, sworn deceitfully. This is the idea that we

410
00:26:33.319 --> 00:26:36.440
have a pure heart. A pure heart would be well

411
00:26:36.599 --> 00:26:39.559
what we need, because well we have an unclean heart.

412
00:26:40.039 --> 00:26:43.119
All right. Now, we could get into oh well, I

413
00:26:43.200 --> 00:26:44.799
want to go to all Psalm twenty four, but we

414
00:26:44.839 --> 00:26:47.759
won't go into that right now. Right basically is showing

415
00:26:48.200 --> 00:26:53.279
that it's the heart where sin, where all this arises from.

416
00:26:54.240 --> 00:26:59.079
All right. So, the heart is the seat of thought

417
00:26:59.160 --> 00:27:02.160
and understanding. It is the center of emotion and feelings,

418
00:27:02.599 --> 00:27:05.720
is the center of will and decision making. It is

419
00:27:06.680 --> 00:27:10.519
the moral and spiritual core. Next, it is the place

420
00:27:10.640 --> 00:27:14.440
of relationship with God. The heart is often where one's

421
00:27:14.480 --> 00:27:17.119
relationship with God is most deeply expressed. A heart that

422
00:27:17.200 --> 00:27:19.640
seeks God, trusts God, or loves God is seen as

423
00:27:19.759 --> 00:27:23.200
key to a vibrant spiritual life. Psalm seventy three, twenty six.

424
00:27:23.359 --> 00:27:26.039
My flesh and my heart may fail, but God is

425
00:27:26.119 --> 00:27:29.279
the strength of my heart and my portion forever. In

426
00:27:29.440 --> 00:27:32.119
this psalm, the Salmis expresses that God is the source

427
00:27:32.200 --> 00:27:34.759
of strength for both body and soul, relying on God

428
00:27:34.839 --> 00:27:36.519
even when the heart is that the center of the

429
00:27:36.599 --> 00:27:40.319
inner life is weak. So their argument is that the

430
00:27:40.440 --> 00:27:43.640
heart is connected to our relationship with God. It's kind

431
00:27:43.680 --> 00:27:47.160
of where it's the place of our relationship. It's a

432
00:27:47.279 --> 00:27:50.839
heart based relationship, not just a mind based relationship. That

433
00:27:50.880 --> 00:27:53.480
would be separating heart and mind. But then the heart

434
00:27:53.640 --> 00:27:56.880
is the center of intellect and thought, so then it

435
00:27:56.960 --> 00:28:02.079
becomes well, a little bit more, but we get the

436
00:28:02.119 --> 00:28:08.039
basic idea, all right, So and I have more here,

437
00:28:08.039 --> 00:28:10.160
I'm gonna skip this. The concept of the heart and

438
00:28:10.240 --> 00:28:13.599
the psalm is rich and multifaceted. It touches on thoughts

439
00:28:13.640 --> 00:28:21.279
and intellect, emotions, will, moral purity, and spiritual life. The

440
00:28:21.400 --> 00:28:25.119
heart encompasses all of that thought and intellect, emotions, will

441
00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:28.480
and decision making, moral purity and spiritual life, and the

442
00:28:28.640 --> 00:28:31.480
historical and cultural context of the Psalms. The heart was

443
00:28:31.559 --> 00:28:35.440
considered the essence of a person's being. Ancient Hebrew, the

444
00:28:36.200 --> 00:28:42.480
thought did not separate intellect, emotion, and moral capacities into

445
00:28:42.759 --> 00:28:48.400
distinct categories like modern Western thought often does. Instead, the

446
00:28:48.519 --> 00:28:52.720
heart represented the totality of the inner self that we

447
00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:59.079
might not we would call mind, will and emotions. So,

448
00:28:59.200 --> 00:29:02.599
at least in the Hebrew, at least in the Old Testament,

449
00:29:02.880 --> 00:29:06.119
the heart encompasses all. We want to separate it, We

450
00:29:06.240 --> 00:29:08.640
want to dissect it and say, well, here's the heart,

451
00:29:08.759 --> 00:29:12.000
here's the will, here's this, here's no, no, no, no,

452
00:29:12.359 --> 00:29:18.440
it's all encompassed together. It's all there and we and

453
00:29:18.640 --> 00:29:23.079
therefore guess what. That's where sin is coming from, because

454
00:29:23.079 --> 00:29:26.319
it controls every aspect of us. That's why we continue

455
00:29:26.359 --> 00:29:29.680
to sin, because there's still the corruption inside. We still

456
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:35.279
have a sinful heart and a pilological sense. The Psalmist

457
00:29:35.319 --> 00:29:37.960
recognizes the heart as the place where true relationship with

458
00:29:38.000 --> 00:29:42.319
God is cultivated or where sin festers. There are many

459
00:29:42.400 --> 00:29:45.160
psalms includes please for a clean heart, for God to

460
00:29:45.200 --> 00:29:47.000
search the heart, or for the Psalmist to have a

461
00:29:47.039 --> 00:29:50.559
steadfast heart. The heart's condition is crucial because it directly

462
00:29:50.640 --> 00:29:53.359
impacts how a person lives out their faith and trust

463
00:29:53.559 --> 00:29:58.359
in God. That's my entire point. We can't get to

464
00:29:58.480 --> 00:30:03.519
perfection or what a perpetual state of sin. Logically, that

465
00:30:03.599 --> 00:30:08.039
would only mean one thing. The heart is still not

466
00:30:08.880 --> 00:30:12.319
right once the heart. If you make the argument that

467
00:30:12.440 --> 00:30:15.920
the heart is completely new and completely transformed, then there

468
00:30:16.000 --> 00:30:18.720
is no way for you to then make some excuse

469
00:30:19.279 --> 00:30:23.319
for ongoing sin. You would have to argue everyone can

470
00:30:23.400 --> 00:30:29.759
be perfect because your heart controls every aspect of your being. No,

471
00:30:31.960 --> 00:30:36.640
the heart is not right. I think we have to

472
00:30:36.720 --> 00:30:40.200
understand that when the Psalmist mentions the heart they're referring

473
00:30:40.240 --> 00:30:43.799
to the inner core of a person, the seed of thought, emotion, will,

474
00:30:43.880 --> 00:30:46.960
and moral character. The heart is central to one's relationship

475
00:30:47.000 --> 00:30:49.359
with God and where decisions are made to follow trust

476
00:30:49.440 --> 00:30:51.839
or rebel against Him. This understanding of the heart is

477
00:30:51.920 --> 00:30:54.960
integral to grasping the spiritual and emotional depth of the

478
00:30:55.000 --> 00:30:59.160
psalms as they express the full range of human experience

479
00:30:59.279 --> 00:31:04.799
and relation to God. So then I was like, okay, well,

480
00:31:04.880 --> 00:31:11.279
this sounds like the heart and nature. I mean that,

481
00:31:11.759 --> 00:31:14.839
how do you separate heart and nature? So I was like,

482
00:31:14.920 --> 00:31:16.680
I was a little perplexed by this. I was a

483
00:31:16.720 --> 00:31:20.559
little confused by it. I'm like, okay, because typically Christians

484
00:31:20.559 --> 00:31:22.680
will say I have a new heart and a new nature,

485
00:31:22.759 --> 00:31:24.880
as if they're two separate things and both of them

486
00:31:24.880 --> 00:31:27.400
are new. Some will say, well, we have a new heart,

487
00:31:27.559 --> 00:31:29.640
but we have an old nature. Well then wait a minute,

488
00:31:29.640 --> 00:31:32.640
where's the old name? And if the heart controls every

489
00:31:32.759 --> 00:31:35.519
wouldn't the heart trump the nature? Then it just becomes

490
00:31:36.039 --> 00:31:39.640
confounding and confusing. Just look, I told you for the

491
00:31:39.680 --> 00:31:41.920
sermon's two point oh app sermon challenge. Just start listening

492
00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:45.200
to random sermons on new heart, old heart, new nature,

493
00:31:45.279 --> 00:31:46.960
old nature, and I told you it was going to

494
00:31:47.000 --> 00:31:51.119
be utterly completely confounding because of the craziness you're going

495
00:31:51.160 --> 00:31:53.119
to hear. And we reviewed a little bit, and it

496
00:31:53.240 --> 00:31:55.279
was insane, like I still don't even know what that

497
00:31:55.359 --> 00:31:58.200
we were referring to, or they couldn't even really make

498
00:31:58.240 --> 00:32:00.359
it make sense. They would make a claim and then

499
00:32:00.519 --> 00:32:04.160
almost contradict the claim fifteen minutes later in the sermon.

500
00:32:05.559 --> 00:32:09.000
So how do we make sense of this? Well, in

501
00:32:09.079 --> 00:32:11.640
this case, I'm like, okay, AI, how do we under

502
00:32:11.799 --> 00:32:14.279
if the heart is all of these things? How does

503
00:32:14.319 --> 00:32:18.759
the heart relate to the nature? So AI is going

504
00:32:18.839 --> 00:32:20.599
to get a little contradictory here as well. But this

505
00:32:20.759 --> 00:32:24.000
is what they say, Ai said. The heart and the

506
00:32:24.039 --> 00:32:28.599
psalms can be closely associated with a person's nature, though

507
00:32:28.680 --> 00:32:33.200
they're not entirely synonymous. Oh boy, this gets confusing. So

508
00:32:33.319 --> 00:32:36.960
they're closely related, but they're not the same. The term

509
00:32:37.240 --> 00:32:41.200
heart refers to the inner core of a person's thoughts, will, emotion,

510
00:32:41.640 --> 00:32:45.799
and moral character, which shapes their behavior and relationship with God.

511
00:32:46.359 --> 00:32:50.039
This concept is related to what we might call someone's nature,

512
00:32:50.680 --> 00:32:56.440
the inherent inclinations, desires, and tendency that drives a person's actions.

513
00:32:56.519 --> 00:32:59.200
And decisions. Okay, well that to me, it sounds like

514
00:32:59.240 --> 00:33:03.720
they're synonymous. But then Ai said, however, there are some

515
00:33:04.119 --> 00:33:09.319
nuances to consider when equitting the heart with a person's nature.

516
00:33:09.440 --> 00:33:13.640
And I'm like, oh boy, okay, so they're not synonymous,

517
00:33:14.319 --> 00:33:19.519
but they're the same, but there's a slight nuance. Okay,

518
00:33:19.839 --> 00:33:24.680
are you ready for this? The heart and biblical language,

519
00:33:25.240 --> 00:33:28.119
is the center of a person's being, encompassing their intellect

520
00:33:28.240 --> 00:33:31.000
or emotion, their moral life. It is part of a person.

521
00:33:31.359 --> 00:33:33.279
It's a part of a person that interacts with God,

522
00:33:33.400 --> 00:33:36.160
responds to his word, and is responsible for decisions, whether

523
00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:40.759
good or evil. The nature, now, this is what they

524
00:33:40.799 --> 00:33:45.480
say in philological terms, refers to the inherent tendencies, are

525
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:50.440
qualities that defines a person's character. For example, in Christian theology,

526
00:33:50.799 --> 00:33:54.319
human nature is often understood to be fallen, inclining towards

527
00:33:54.400 --> 00:33:57.599
sin and in need of redemption. When someone is transformed

528
00:33:57.640 --> 00:34:01.680
by God, their nature is renewed, aligning more closely with

529
00:34:02.839 --> 00:34:06.000
God's will. Now I'm going to immediately argue, wait, no, no, no, no,

530
00:34:06.359 --> 00:34:09.639
not everyone believes the nature is transformed, but they're trying

531
00:34:09.679 --> 00:34:13.760
to so immediately, you see, where so the heart is this,

532
00:34:14.119 --> 00:34:19.800
But the nature is it's inherent tendencies, qualities that define

533
00:34:19.840 --> 00:34:23.559
a person's character. That sounds just like the heart. But

534
00:34:23.679 --> 00:34:25.840
it sounds like what AI is trying to do is

535
00:34:25.880 --> 00:34:29.920
that within Christianity it runs into the same conflict, right,

536
00:34:29.960 --> 00:34:33.039
because AI is pulling from all of Christian theology that

537
00:34:33.239 --> 00:34:36.519
has access to and it realizes, we'll wait a minute,

538
00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:43.840
I've got to separate these two somehow, because Christianity talks

539
00:34:43.840 --> 00:34:46.000
about a new nature. Well, if we have a new

540
00:34:46.079 --> 00:34:48.719
nature and we have now again, if you have a

541
00:34:48.800 --> 00:34:50.960
new nature and a new heart, I don't know how

542
00:34:51.039 --> 00:34:53.159
you could not are You would have to believe that

543
00:34:53.519 --> 00:34:59.000
perfection is not only probable, it's it's the only logical outcome.

544
00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:02.599
Oh do you draw a distinction between the nature and

545
00:35:02.639 --> 00:35:08.719
the heart. It becomes confusing. In many aspects, the heart

546
00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:11.000
can be viewed as the place where a person's nature

547
00:35:11.159 --> 00:35:14.880
is expressed. Now, this one is literally confusing. Right, So

548
00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:20.320
you have the nature, but the heart expresses the nature. Now, well,

549
00:35:20.360 --> 00:35:24.320
if the heart is expressing the nature and we cannot

550
00:35:24.400 --> 00:35:27.440
get to sinless perfection, well, then the heart is expressing

551
00:35:27.599 --> 00:35:30.559
obviously a fallen nature. Because if the nature was perfect

552
00:35:30.599 --> 00:35:34.599
and the heart expresses the perfect nature. You see how

553
00:35:34.920 --> 00:35:38.480
that would get confused moral inclinations. The heart is often

554
00:35:38.519 --> 00:35:41.400
described in terms of moral purity or corruption. A pure

555
00:35:41.480 --> 00:35:44.280
heart Psalm twenty four to four reflects a righteous nature,

556
00:35:44.639 --> 00:35:47.320
while a wicked heart reflects a sinful nature. This aligns

557
00:35:47.360 --> 00:35:49.800
with the idea that one's nature determines the state of

558
00:35:49.920 --> 00:35:53.639
the heart. So this is the idea that the nature

559
00:35:53.760 --> 00:35:56.920
determines this. If your nature is right, then your heart

560
00:35:57.079 --> 00:35:59.960
is right. If your nature is wrong, then your heart

561
00:36:00.119 --> 00:36:03.800
art is wrong. Well, then I would argue, because Christians

562
00:36:03.840 --> 00:36:07.199
are in a perpetual status sin, which we are, well,

563
00:36:07.239 --> 00:36:09.480
then the nature can't be right nor can the heart

564
00:36:09.559 --> 00:36:12.360
be right. If you want to draw a distinction between

565
00:36:12.440 --> 00:36:14.400
these two, but I think you're trying to draw a

566
00:36:14.440 --> 00:36:18.320
distinction that really doesn't make a lot of Like, I

567
00:36:18.360 --> 00:36:22.000
don't think it really works. Desire and will. Both the

568
00:36:22.119 --> 00:36:25.079
heart and a person's nature reflects the desires and inclinations

569
00:36:25.119 --> 00:36:28.000
that drive actions. A person with a fixed heart is

570
00:36:28.079 --> 00:36:31.039
someone whose nature is oriented towards God, showing a deep

571
00:36:31.079 --> 00:36:33.800
resolve to follow Him, and biblical terms, the heart is

572
00:36:33.880 --> 00:36:37.039
often determines one's orientation towards God. Whether the person is

573
00:36:37.119 --> 00:36:40.199
righteous or rebellious. Similarly, the nature of a person, whether

574
00:36:40.320 --> 00:36:43.960
sinful or sanctified, also determines the relationship with God. So

575
00:36:44.079 --> 00:36:46.719
they're like, well, in a sense, they do the same thing,

576
00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:53.880
but somehow they're different. It becomes it's like we're trying

577
00:36:53.920 --> 00:36:58.599
to draw a distinction that really doesn't really matter. Now

578
00:36:59.119 --> 00:37:02.719
they try to offer where they're different. Heart as dynamic

579
00:37:03.400 --> 00:37:07.960
versus the nature, which is static. The heart can change, grow,

580
00:37:08.079 --> 00:37:10.760
and respond to circumstances, as we see throughout the psalms,

581
00:37:11.000 --> 00:37:13.199
where the psalm is often pleads for a clean heart

582
00:37:13.400 --> 00:37:16.280
or praises God for a steadfast heart. This suggests the

583
00:37:16.360 --> 00:37:20.719
heart is somewhat dynamic, influenced by decisions experiences in God's intervention.

584
00:37:21.400 --> 00:37:25.079
The nature in philological context often refers to a more

585
00:37:25.199 --> 00:37:30.519
innate underlying condition, especially and the distinction between sinful nature

586
00:37:30.559 --> 00:37:33.440
and renewed nature in Christian theology. While the heart can

587
00:37:33.480 --> 00:37:37.760
be influenced or renewed, the idea of nature often describes

588
00:37:37.800 --> 00:37:42.920
a person's basic moral and spiritual condition. So they try

589
00:37:42.960 --> 00:37:47.000
to say the heart is bouncing around and can be influenced,

590
00:37:47.119 --> 00:37:52.599
where the nature is static and just stays the same. Well,

591
00:37:52.639 --> 00:37:55.400
can then does the heart impact the nature? Does the

592
00:37:55.480 --> 00:37:58.800
nature impact the heart? See now it's becoming. How are

593
00:37:58.840 --> 00:38:03.400
you going to draw these distinctions? I don't know. I

594
00:38:03.480 --> 00:38:07.920
don't know. The heart is where a person engages with God,

595
00:38:08.039 --> 00:38:11.360
making decisions to follow or rebel, to trust or fear.

596
00:38:11.559 --> 00:38:14.000
It's the side of moral and spiritual activity. While the

597
00:38:14.079 --> 00:38:17.039
heart reflects a person's nature, it is more intimately involved

598
00:38:17.079 --> 00:38:19.719
in the process of responding to God. Nature, on the

599
00:38:19.800 --> 00:38:22.760
other hand, tends to describe the broader condition or inclination

600
00:38:22.920 --> 00:38:26.280
of a person, especially concerning their fallenness or redemption. In

601
00:38:26.360 --> 00:38:30.039
Christian thought and summary, the heart and nature are closely

602
00:38:30.159 --> 00:38:34.000
connected with the heart, with the heart often expressing or

603
00:38:34.039 --> 00:38:38.000
reflecting a person's nature, desires, and inclinations. And biblical terms,

604
00:38:38.039 --> 00:38:40.440
the heart is the dynamic center of a person's being,

605
00:38:40.840 --> 00:38:44.840
influencing thought, emotion, and choices. The nature of a person

606
00:38:45.639 --> 00:38:49.199
refers more broadly to the inherent moral and spiritual state,

607
00:38:49.480 --> 00:38:52.400
whether fallen or renewed. Thus, while the heart can reflect

608
00:38:52.440 --> 00:38:55.559
a person's nature, it is more specific term referring to

609
00:38:55.639 --> 00:38:58.719
the inner life and decision making process, and more frequently

610
00:38:58.800 --> 00:39:04.039
associated with the way an individual engages with God. So

611
00:39:04.239 --> 00:39:09.199
I'm like they they're kind of the same, but they're

612
00:39:09.280 --> 00:39:11.920
kind of different. I mean, they kind of do the

613
00:39:12.000 --> 00:39:15.440
same thing. Well, one reflects the other. I don't know.

614
00:39:15.760 --> 00:39:20.800
I see, it's to me that just caught well. Put

615
00:39:20.840 --> 00:39:23.960
it this way, if the heart reflects the nature and

616
00:39:24.119 --> 00:39:27.400
the heart still cannot be perfect, well, then that means

617
00:39:27.440 --> 00:39:29.960
the nature cannot be perfect. I think, I think what

618
00:39:30.159 --> 00:39:32.559
you I think, maybe you could argue, even if you

619
00:39:32.639 --> 00:39:36.800
make these separate, if a Christian cannot just will and

620
00:39:37.039 --> 00:39:43.360
desire and choose to be perfect, that means there's something wrong. Well,

621
00:39:43.400 --> 00:39:45.360
then that would be either something wrong with the nature.

622
00:39:45.559 --> 00:39:47.639
But how could the nature be wrong and the heart

623
00:39:47.719 --> 00:39:55.840
be right? So to me, you can't have one right

624
00:39:55.960 --> 00:39:58.719
one wrong, I think. I think in that sense, if

625
00:39:58.800 --> 00:40:01.800
one's reflecting the other, there would have to both be wrong.

626
00:40:03.880 --> 00:40:07.079
So I don't know drawing a distinction here, I don't

627
00:40:07.119 --> 00:40:09.960
know what we hope to accomplish by that. I don't

628
00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:13.480
know if it makes any sense. But rather I was

629
00:40:13.559 --> 00:40:16.320
profoundly kind of confused by this, and mainly I was

630
00:40:16.400 --> 00:40:20.599
bothered by AI trying to basically claim, well, within Christian theology,

631
00:40:21.159 --> 00:40:24.000
the nature is changed, or the heart is changed, it

632
00:40:24.159 --> 00:40:27.920
is transformed. So I pushed back on AI, and I

633
00:40:28.000 --> 00:40:29.840
was like, well, wait a minute, Wait a minute. Not

634
00:40:30.000 --> 00:40:34.400
everyone within Christianity thinks this way. So AI said this,

635
00:40:36.039 --> 00:40:40.079
You're absolutely correct. And this touches on a significant theological

636
00:40:40.159 --> 00:40:44.599
distinction that varies between different Christian traditions regarding the how

637
00:40:44.719 --> 00:40:48.800
the heart and nature are understood in relation to salvation

638
00:40:49.039 --> 00:40:54.719
and sanctification. While some systems of Christian theology emphasize a

639
00:40:54.800 --> 00:40:57.880
complete transformation of the heart and nature at the moment

640
00:40:57.960 --> 00:41:02.599
of salvation, others may that all though believers are transformed

641
00:41:03.119 --> 00:41:08.639
positionally before God justified and declared righteous, they continue to

642
00:41:08.679 --> 00:41:13.599
struggle with a sinful nature and a sinful heart throughout

643
00:41:14.119 --> 00:41:19.559
their entire existence on earth. This latter view is often

644
00:41:19.639 --> 00:41:22.480
used to explain why Christians continue to sin and why

645
00:41:22.599 --> 00:41:28.440
perfection in this life remains unattainable. So I'm on the

646
00:41:28.559 --> 00:41:31.360
camp that says, look, clearly, we don't have a new heart,

647
00:41:31.559 --> 00:41:34.039
Clearly we don't have a new nature because we continue

648
00:41:34.039 --> 00:41:38.239
to sin and perfection is unattainable. That look, that's not

649
00:41:38.360 --> 00:41:43.119
even a philological argument, that's just a factual statement. Christians

650
00:41:43.119 --> 00:41:46.000
are in a perpetual status sin because we cannot keep

651
00:41:46.039 --> 00:41:50.639
the law perfectly the law demands perfection, So therefore we

652
00:41:50.920 --> 00:41:53.800
still have these sinful things inside of us. Now, the

653
00:41:53.920 --> 00:41:59.559
minute you acknowledge that everyone pastor, Sunday school teacher, deacon,

654
00:42:00.639 --> 00:42:06.519
worship leader, youth director, Sunday school teacher, children's ministry director,

655
00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:11.559
people in the pew, everyone still has a sinful nature

656
00:42:11.559 --> 00:42:13.440
and a sinful heart. If you want to draw a

657
00:42:13.519 --> 00:42:16.400
distinction between the two, then guess what is going to

658
00:42:16.480 --> 00:42:31.239
be the normal reality of the Christian life. Sin Two.

659
00:42:31.760 --> 00:42:35.800
There are two philological views. You have the transformation view

660
00:42:36.840 --> 00:42:44.559
versus the positional change view, transformation versus position, or transformational

661
00:42:44.920 --> 00:42:51.480
versus positional. The transformation view says that that transformation ad salvation.

662
00:42:51.639 --> 00:42:56.599
This is associated with systems like Wesleyan Methodists, Holiness, and

663
00:42:56.719 --> 00:43:00.679
some aspects of Pentecostal theology. Now what confound me is

664
00:43:00.760 --> 00:43:02.800
you have people who are more in the reform camp

665
00:43:03.159 --> 00:43:08.199
who supposedly holds to reform theology, but they will almost

666
00:43:08.280 --> 00:43:14.360
inevitably express the transformational view. They won't express the positional view.

667
00:43:15.239 --> 00:43:20.119
We have been so influenced by a charismatic Wesleyan theology

668
00:43:20.440 --> 00:43:23.599
that even reform people who talk a big game about

669
00:43:23.679 --> 00:43:29.960
reform theology abandon it on this position. So in this

670
00:43:30.679 --> 00:43:36.400
Pentecostal Wesleyan holiness. Some aspects of charismatic theology, they would

671
00:43:36.440 --> 00:43:41.440
say this salvation includes not only a positional justification being

672
00:43:41.480 --> 00:43:46.199
declared righteous before God, but a moral transformation of the

673
00:43:46.400 --> 00:43:50.400
heart and nature. Some traditions even teach that Christians can

674
00:43:50.440 --> 00:43:54.440
reach a level of entire sanctification or moral perfection where

675
00:43:54.760 --> 00:43:59.239
they no longer sin. Proponents argue that the believer receives

676
00:43:59.360 --> 00:44:03.760
a new heart and transform nature as promised in scripture.

677
00:44:03.880 --> 00:44:06.599
And again, where are they going to quote is Ezequel

678
00:44:06.679 --> 00:44:10.519
thirty six, which I've said now fifty million times. I

679
00:44:10.639 --> 00:44:13.480
can't I can't stand when people do that. Go read

680
00:44:13.519 --> 00:44:17.880
Ezequel thirty six. It's Israel, Israel, Israel, Israel, Israel. And

681
00:44:18.000 --> 00:44:20.719
what happens after they get a new heart they go

682
00:44:20.920 --> 00:44:24.000
into the land which was promised to their fathers. That's

683
00:44:24.079 --> 00:44:28.320
not the Church, that's not you, that's not me, that's Israel.

684
00:44:29.119 --> 00:44:31.880
Israel will be given a new heart when they go

685
00:44:32.079 --> 00:44:35.880
into the land, and that has never occurred in history.

686
00:44:36.239 --> 00:44:39.519
So I'm not going to turn that into typological interpretation.

687
00:44:40.880 --> 00:44:43.360
Israel will be saved, they will get a new heart,

688
00:44:43.599 --> 00:44:46.199
they will get the land. You said, well, that's dispensational.

689
00:44:46.320 --> 00:44:48.559
That's I don't care which camp you put it in.

690
00:44:49.039 --> 00:44:52.719
It just it makes sense because no one has gotten

691
00:44:52.760 --> 00:44:55.320
a new heart. Because even in Ezequel thirty six, it

692
00:44:55.360 --> 00:44:57.519
basically says, when you get a new heart, you're going

693
00:44:57.599 --> 00:45:00.280
to obey all of my commands. Well, do you all

694
00:45:00.280 --> 00:45:02.599
of his commands? No? Then that's proof you don't have

695
00:45:02.679 --> 00:45:05.320
a new heart. Do I obey all of his commands? No,

696
00:45:05.880 --> 00:45:08.599
that's proof I don't have a new heart. But Christians

697
00:45:08.639 --> 00:45:11.760
want to say, you have a new heart, but you

698
00:45:11.840 --> 00:45:15.119
can't be perfect. No, if I have a new heart,

699
00:45:15.320 --> 00:45:17.599
I can be perfect, especially if we understand the heart

700
00:45:17.920 --> 00:45:21.559
is the center of the will, the intellect, the emotion.

701
00:45:22.280 --> 00:45:24.960
Or you can't say you have a new nature. If

702
00:45:25.000 --> 00:45:28.760
heart reflects the new nature, well then we should be perfect.

703
00:45:29.559 --> 00:45:32.639
They also quote Tewod Corinthians five seventeen. Therefore, if anyone

704
00:45:32.760 --> 00:45:35.400
is in Christ, he's a new creature. All things have

705
00:45:35.480 --> 00:45:38.360
passed away. Behold all things that become new once again.

706
00:45:38.599 --> 00:45:41.840
If that verse is true, even in the slightest way, practically,

707
00:45:42.599 --> 00:45:45.920
then there is no more sin, because there's nothing old left.

708
00:45:46.400 --> 00:45:49.280
Where are you sinning? What? Why are you fighting? Against sin.

709
00:45:49.519 --> 00:45:52.880
Where does sin even arise from? Because you're completely new.

710
00:45:53.000 --> 00:45:56.280
That would mean there's nothing inside of you that desires sin.

711
00:45:56.400 --> 00:45:59.880
Everything in you is perfect and holy. It makes no sin.

712
00:46:01.199 --> 00:46:04.840
In this view, the sin nature is either significantly diminished.

713
00:46:04.920 --> 00:46:07.519
What you can't say it's diminished and say you have

714
00:46:07.599 --> 00:46:09.360
a new heart and you're a new creature and old

715
00:46:09.400 --> 00:46:12.000
has passed away. You can't quote those verses and then

716
00:46:12.159 --> 00:46:15.760
argued for a diminished old nature or a diminished old heart. No,

717
00:46:16.039 --> 00:46:20.000
you would have to believe in the eradication of the

718
00:46:20.119 --> 00:46:23.039
sinful heart and that the heart is perfect. The focus

719
00:46:23.079 --> 00:46:27.440
here is This side tries to claim the focus here

720
00:46:27.519 --> 00:46:31.239
is on progressive sanctification, where the believer increasingly grows in holiness.

721
00:46:31.400 --> 00:46:35.719
Makes no sense. You don't progressively grow in holiness if

722
00:46:35.760 --> 00:46:38.559
you already have a now completely new heart and a

723
00:46:38.639 --> 00:46:41.320
completely new nature and the old is completely gone and

724
00:46:41.440 --> 00:46:46.440
everything is new, there's no progressive You've been instantaneously transformed

725
00:46:46.519 --> 00:46:51.400
into perfection. You can't argue for progressive sanctification while at

726
00:46:51.440 --> 00:46:55.159
the same time stating at the moment of salvation, boom,

727
00:46:55.400 --> 00:46:58.800
new heart, new nature, everything is transformed. No, then there's

728
00:46:58.880 --> 00:47:06.559
nothing progressive. I literally my entire programming, all of my

729
00:47:06.800 --> 00:47:16.039
internal programming has been replaced with a programming that says God, Jesus, holiness, love, perfection,

730
00:47:16.679 --> 00:47:19.920
love perfection, and so everything would be. That's what I

731
00:47:19.960 --> 00:47:30.360
would do now, the positional change or continued struggle change.

732
00:47:31.239 --> 00:47:34.079
This should be common in the reformed world, But what

733
00:47:34.199 --> 00:47:36.480
I've seen in the Reformed world is an abandonment of this.

734
00:47:37.639 --> 00:47:41.440
It should be true in the Calvinistic world, which I

735
00:47:41.559 --> 00:47:44.440
hold to our reform theology. I hold to a Calvinistic view,

736
00:47:44.760 --> 00:47:47.679
but yet for some reason, it just just listen to

737
00:47:49.400 --> 00:47:52.480
when people when a Calvinist falls into sin, it'll be

738
00:47:52.559 --> 00:47:55.719
the non Calvinist going, well, they think they can be perfect. Well, No,

739
00:47:56.440 --> 00:47:58.440
the Calvinist view and the reform view should be the

740
00:47:58.480 --> 00:48:00.920
one that says, no, no, we believe in a positional change.

741
00:48:02.000 --> 00:48:04.840
The only place I've ever really been taught the positional

742
00:48:04.920 --> 00:48:09.000
change view to any true meaning was in the Lutheran

743
00:48:09.119 --> 00:48:13.840
Church when I wanted to become a Lutheran pastor. In

744
00:48:14.039 --> 00:48:17.920
this view, at the moment of salvation, the believer is justified,

745
00:48:18.000 --> 00:48:22.159
declared righteous positionally before God because of Christ righteousness imputed

746
00:48:22.199 --> 00:48:26.159
to them. However, the believer still retains a sinful nature

747
00:48:26.320 --> 00:48:30.000
and continues to struggle with sin. The perspective holds that

748
00:48:30.079 --> 00:48:32.320
will believers are a new creation in terms of their

749
00:48:32.360 --> 00:48:36.199
standing before God, their inner nature is still marked by sin,

750
00:48:36.480 --> 00:48:40.119
which explains why Christians continue to sin after salvation. That

751
00:48:40.360 --> 00:48:45.280
is my view. We are transformed positionally, but internally we

752
00:48:45.400 --> 00:48:47.840
are just as messed up as we were before we

753
00:48:48.039 --> 00:48:50.760
were saved. The only thing that changes in my salvation

754
00:48:51.280 --> 00:48:54.800
is my position before God. I am the same sinner,

755
00:48:55.320 --> 00:48:58.119
and that's why I continue to sin and struggle with sin.

756
00:48:58.360 --> 00:49:02.079
And what have we seen in church for two thousand years?

757
00:49:02.440 --> 00:49:07.519
Sin sin sin, sin, sin, sin, sin, sin sin. We've

758
00:49:07.599 --> 00:49:10.400
seen it in the leadership, We've seen it in the membership,

759
00:49:10.480 --> 00:49:15.400
We've seen it everywhere. Sin, it's the most common thing.

760
00:49:20.320 --> 00:49:23.639
This view aligns with the idea of the idea of

761
00:49:23.760 --> 00:49:26.519
being righteous and a sinner at the same time. That's

762
00:49:26.639 --> 00:49:30.119
Luther's famous concept. I am a saint and a sinner

763
00:49:30.239 --> 00:49:34.199
at the very same time. How I'm a saint positionally,

764
00:49:34.559 --> 00:49:37.719
but in practice, I'm a sinner. That's why, throughout two

765
00:49:37.840 --> 00:49:41.320
thousand years of church history, anyone who holds to any

766
00:49:41.360 --> 00:49:44.760
type of a liturgical service, they begin, why do you

767
00:49:44.840 --> 00:49:47.760
we begin Why do they begin services with this type

768
00:49:47.800 --> 00:49:51.280
of confession, Most Merciful God, we confess that we have

769
00:49:51.360 --> 00:49:56.760
sinned against you and thought word. Indeed, by what we

770
00:49:56.920 --> 00:49:59.320
have done and by what we have left undone, we

771
00:49:59.400 --> 00:50:01.239
have not loved you with our whole heart. We have

772
00:50:01.320 --> 00:50:04.159
not loved our neighbors as ourselves. We are truly sorry,

773
00:50:04.400 --> 00:50:06.880
and we humbly repent for the sake of your son,

774
00:50:07.079 --> 00:50:10.079
Jesus Christ, Have mercy on us and forgive us. Why

775
00:50:10.119 --> 00:50:12.199
do you have to Why do they give that confession

776
00:50:12.320 --> 00:50:15.039
every time there's a church service, Because every time you

777
00:50:15.119 --> 00:50:17.920
have a church service, you have a gathering of sinners

778
00:50:18.239 --> 00:50:21.639
who are declared saints positionally, but in practice they have

779
00:50:21.840 --> 00:50:24.760
sinned on their way to church. They may be they're

780
00:50:24.760 --> 00:50:27.079
in a perpetual state of sin while sitting in church,

781
00:50:27.159 --> 00:50:29.079
because none of them are holy as God is holy,

782
00:50:29.280 --> 00:50:32.119
and they're going to sin immediately after church. They're going

783
00:50:32.199 --> 00:50:35.000
to think wrong thoughts. They're gonna gossip, they're gonna slander,

784
00:50:35.079 --> 00:50:37.079
They're gonna be filled with lust, They're gonna be filled

785
00:50:37.119 --> 00:50:40.719
with murder in their heart. There's going to be coveteousness, idolatry,

786
00:50:41.000 --> 00:50:44.840
you name the sin, it can happen inside any believer.

787
00:50:45.199 --> 00:50:49.000
Any believer can commit any sin at any time because

788
00:50:49.039 --> 00:50:52.119
they're in a perpetual state of sin. I can't stand

789
00:50:52.119 --> 00:50:54.719
when Christians will say, well, you may be, you may

790
00:50:54.760 --> 00:50:56.719
be still a sinner, but you won't live in sin.

791
00:50:57.000 --> 00:50:59.880
You're living in sin, ladies and gentlemen, You're in a

792
00:51:00.000 --> 00:51:09.880
perpetual state of sin. In this framework, Christians are justified

793
00:51:09.920 --> 00:51:16.679
before God, righteous, but continue to sin throughout their lives.

794
00:51:21.239 --> 00:51:24.840
Christians are positionally righteous, but their heart and nature remain

795
00:51:24.960 --> 00:51:27.880
in attention between the already and the not yet of salvation.

796
00:51:28.280 --> 00:51:32.239
They're already declared righteous, but not yet made fully righteous

797
00:51:32.440 --> 00:51:38.320
in practice. So then sanctification is just the impossible task

798
00:51:38.440 --> 00:51:42.360
of trying to live out practically what is true positionally.

799
00:51:43.320 --> 00:51:46.719
And sometimes there may be some ground gained, but you know,

800
00:51:47.000 --> 00:51:50.480
it's it's almost it's impossible to measure. Because you can look.

801
00:51:50.519 --> 00:51:52.840
Anybody can clean up the outside of their life to

802
00:51:53.039 --> 00:51:57.840
some level, right, Mormons do so, Muslims do so, Atheists

803
00:51:57.880 --> 00:52:00.679
do so. They can even talk about major trees transformations

804
00:52:00.679 --> 00:52:02.880
in their life where they went from being a drug

805
00:52:02.920 --> 00:52:05.639
addict to being completely clean. Has nothing to do with God,

806
00:52:05.840 --> 00:52:09.360
has nothing to do with salvation. It's just their own

807
00:52:09.800 --> 00:52:13.440
cleaning up their external part. The issue is, though, no

808
00:52:13.519 --> 00:52:17.760
matter how much you try to measure someone's sanctification, it's subjective,

809
00:52:18.039 --> 00:52:20.920
because no matter how clean someone is on the outside,

810
00:52:21.320 --> 00:52:23.719
you have no idea what's going on on the inside.

811
00:52:24.239 --> 00:52:29.760
You have no idea. You don't know the lust. You

812
00:52:29.800 --> 00:52:32.840
don't know the bitterness. You don't know the unforgiveness. You

813
00:52:32.920 --> 00:52:35.519
don't know the worry. You don't know the anxiety. You

814
00:52:35.559 --> 00:52:38.639
don't know the coveteousness. You don't know the idolatry. You

815
00:52:38.719 --> 00:52:49.760
don't know the pridefulness. You don't know anything. For those

816
00:52:49.840 --> 00:52:53.239
systems of theology that believe Christians retain a sinful nature

817
00:52:53.280 --> 00:52:57.199
after salvation, the following points help explain why believers continue

818
00:52:57.239 --> 00:53:01.239
to sin. Number One, the sinful nation remains. While a

819
00:53:01.280 --> 00:53:04.119
believer's position before God changes, their inner nature is not

820
00:53:04.519 --> 00:53:07.800
transformed in a way that they can stop sinning. The

821
00:53:07.880 --> 00:53:10.480
presence of a sinful nature explains the ongoing struggle with

822
00:53:10.559 --> 00:53:13.599
temptation and moral failure. Christians are engaged in a constant

823
00:53:13.679 --> 00:53:23.239
battle between the flesh the sinful nature. Even though Christians

824
00:53:23.280 --> 00:53:28.239
continue to sin, God's grace covers them. This view emphasizes

825
00:53:28.280 --> 00:53:30.920
that it is only through God's ongoing grace that believers

826
00:53:30.920 --> 00:53:33.960
are sustained, and their walk with Christ and their ultimate

827
00:53:34.039 --> 00:53:36.400
hope is not in their own ability to live sinlessly,

828
00:53:36.719 --> 00:53:39.360
but in the righteousness of Christ credited to them. There

829
00:53:39.480 --> 00:53:42.880
is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ,

830
00:53:43.039 --> 00:53:47.079
Jesus and these systems. The heart and nature are not

831
00:53:47.320 --> 00:53:51.119
seen as being fully transformed. The heart remains sinful and

832
00:53:51.199 --> 00:53:54.559
prone to wander and prone to sin. The nature is

833
00:53:54.639 --> 00:53:58.679
not perfect the transformed. So there we go. So, I mean,

834
00:53:58.800 --> 00:54:00.440
I could go through in more details, but you get

835
00:54:00.480 --> 00:54:05.440
the idea. So when we talk about the heart, When

836
00:54:05.480 --> 00:54:07.840
we talk about the heart, the heart is the center

837
00:54:07.920 --> 00:54:10.639
of everything. Now, do you want to draw a distinction

838
00:54:10.760 --> 00:54:13.480
between the heart and the nature. Here's what I will argue.

839
00:54:13.800 --> 00:54:15.639
You can sit there and try to draw a distinction

840
00:54:15.760 --> 00:54:17.559
between heart and nature, and I don't know where you're

841
00:54:17.599 --> 00:54:19.159
really going to go. I don't know what you're really

842
00:54:19.199 --> 00:54:23.119
going to accomplish. So in my point, it's a mute argument,

843
00:54:23.360 --> 00:54:27.199
because here's what I know. When you became saved, your

844
00:54:27.320 --> 00:54:33.000
nature did not change and your heart did not change. Positionally,

845
00:54:33.760 --> 00:54:39.079
you're perfect. Positionally, you are a transformed person. Positionally, every

846
00:54:39.159 --> 00:54:43.239
part of you is perfect because christ perfection are accredited

847
00:54:43.280 --> 00:54:45.719
to your account. So you stand before God as if

848
00:54:45.760 --> 00:54:47.280
you have a new heart, as if you have a

849
00:54:47.360 --> 00:54:50.960
new nature, and you're completely different, and everything is perfect.

850
00:54:51.159 --> 00:54:54.840
But here's the reality of life, and here's how I know.

851
00:54:55.320 --> 00:54:57.440
We don't have a new heart and we don't have

852
00:54:57.519 --> 00:55:04.480
a new nature. We continue to sin and thought, word,

853
00:55:04.840 --> 00:55:07.760
deed and desire. But what we do and about what

854
00:55:07.880 --> 00:55:10.719
we leave undone, Oh ladies and gentlemen, are you ready

855
00:55:10.760 --> 00:55:15.440
for this? And we cannot be perfect. Therefore we're in

856
00:55:15.519 --> 00:55:18.400
a perpetual state of sin. A new heart and a

857
00:55:18.480 --> 00:55:22.199
new nature would not be in a perpetual state of sin.

858
00:55:24.559 --> 00:55:28.960
And that the problem still lies inside of you and

859
00:55:29.119 --> 00:55:33.360
inside of me. Jesus said, all the things that come

860
00:55:33.440 --> 00:55:40.199
out of the heart, what comes out of the heart, lust, fornication, adultery, everything.

861
00:55:40.440 --> 00:55:42.440
So you can't be one of these Christians, say no, no, no,

862
00:55:42.639 --> 00:55:44.760
you can't be a Christian and struggle with that sin.

863
00:55:44.960 --> 00:55:47.119
You can't be a Christian. And if you were, if

864
00:55:47.159 --> 00:55:49.199
you were a Christian, you would no longer commit that

865
00:55:49.239 --> 00:55:51.880
sin or struggle with that sin. That's ridiculous. I don't

866
00:55:51.920 --> 00:55:56.000
care what it is. I don't care. If it's heterosexual sexual,

867
00:55:56.360 --> 00:56:02.039
heterosexual sin of fornication, adult pornography, or lust, you can

868
00:56:02.119 --> 00:56:04.360
still commit it and do it even as a Christian.

869
00:56:04.559 --> 00:56:08.840
I don't care. If it's homosexual sin and lust and pornography,

870
00:56:09.159 --> 00:56:11.639
you can still do so even as a Christian. I

871
00:56:11.719 --> 00:56:14.039
know people are gonna argue, but you can't say, well, no, no,

872
00:56:14.239 --> 00:56:16.039
you can't commit that one, but you can still commit

873
00:56:16.119 --> 00:56:19.159
this one. This is why lordship became so popular, because

874
00:56:19.159 --> 00:56:21.039
it was it tried to say no, no, no. The

875
00:56:21.159 --> 00:56:23.559
reason all these people still sin is they're not saved.

876
00:56:23.719 --> 00:56:26.519
They're not saved. They're not saved, they're not saved. Well,

877
00:56:26.559 --> 00:56:29.440
you spend all of your time telling everyone they're not saved.

878
00:56:29.760 --> 00:56:34.639
Sooner or later, either what you're doing inwardly is going

879
00:56:34.719 --> 00:56:37.400
to be exposed outwardly. And then well, Jane, I guess

880
00:56:37.400 --> 00:56:40.599
you're gonna call into question your own salvation or maybe

881
00:56:40.880 --> 00:56:43.760
it never will be exposed, but one night you're gonna

882
00:56:43.800 --> 00:56:47.119
lay down and maybe, just maybe, by the grace of God,

883
00:56:47.480 --> 00:56:54.320
you're gonna be like if people only knew the sin

884
00:56:54.400 --> 00:56:57.199
in me. Now, what's sad is if you're not careful,

885
00:56:57.880 --> 00:57:00.440
you'll continue to pretend. You won't see your own pride.

886
00:57:01.679 --> 00:57:05.840
You won't see you won't see like the sins that

887
00:57:06.000 --> 00:57:08.239
you should see. You won't see the sins that you

888
00:57:08.320 --> 00:57:13.480
are committing that God himself hates. You won't see your pride,

889
00:57:13.800 --> 00:57:17.079
you won't see your bitterness. You won't see you won't

890
00:57:17.079 --> 00:57:19.519
see the things that God will because you'll only focus

891
00:57:19.599 --> 00:57:22.920
on external sins. You won't focus on the lack of

892
00:57:23.039 --> 00:57:25.199
love in your heart. You won't. You won't. You won't

893
00:57:25.280 --> 00:57:28.280
do that. You'll just you'll can like, for example, a

894
00:57:28.400 --> 00:57:31.000
proud look, you're not gonna see your proud look, a

895
00:57:31.159 --> 00:57:33.840
lying tongue. You're not gonna see when you are there's

896
00:57:33.880 --> 00:57:35.960
some kind of deceit and what you've said or what

897
00:57:36.079 --> 00:57:38.599
you're doing, you're not gonna You're not gonna see that.

898
00:57:38.719 --> 00:57:43.320
Your heart uh deviseth wicked imaginations, you're not gonna see

899
00:57:43.320 --> 00:57:46.000
when you are a false witness. You're not gonna see

900
00:57:46.000 --> 00:57:48.639
when you speak lies and you sow discord among the brethren,

901
00:57:48.760 --> 00:57:51.039
You're not gonna see that because you got to convince

902
00:57:51.079 --> 00:57:53.320
yourself that you're better than you really are instead of

903
00:57:53.480 --> 00:57:55.679
just saying. And what blows my mind is we literally

904
00:57:55.760 --> 00:57:58.840
have something in scripture where someone says, I think the

905
00:57:59.079 --> 00:58:03.119
God that I'm not like all of these people, and

906
00:58:03.239 --> 00:58:05.840
Jesus said that person went home not justified. But then

907
00:58:05.840 --> 00:58:09.039
there was someone else says, Lord, I can't even look up.

908
00:58:09.119 --> 00:58:11.800
I'm a sinner. I'm a sinner. All those things he

909
00:58:11.960 --> 00:58:15.920
doesn't do I do. He doesn't lust, he doesn't fornicate,

910
00:58:16.119 --> 00:58:19.480
he doesn't do that. I do those things. That's the

911
00:58:19.559 --> 00:58:23.920
person who goes home justified. Am I justifying the sin? No?

912
00:58:24.280 --> 00:58:27.199
Am I excusing the sin? No? But that's the only

913
00:58:27.320 --> 00:58:30.559
thing that makes any sense even when you open up

914
00:58:30.599 --> 00:58:33.960
your Bible. When Paul's writing churches, he's writing churches that

915
00:58:34.119 --> 00:58:38.320
are filled with sinners. Paul doesn't tell the church at Corinth, Hey,

916
00:58:38.360 --> 00:58:41.679
you're not saved. He said, you're babes in Christ. You're carnal,

917
00:58:43.079 --> 00:58:46.960
you're fleshley. He called Christians carnal and fleshley because Christians

918
00:58:47.000 --> 00:58:49.519
can be carnal and fleshley. You know why, because we

919
00:58:49.679 --> 00:58:55.800
have a sinful nature that is carnal and fleshley. Now,

920
00:58:55.880 --> 00:59:00.599
you can accomplish certain things from just a purely external perspective,

921
00:59:00.840 --> 00:59:05.679
using discipline, self discipline, fighting against it, you can accomplish

922
00:59:05.760 --> 00:59:09.639
a lot externally, but you have people of all religions

923
00:59:09.679 --> 00:59:13.280
can accomplish a lot morally. Moral they can have a

924
00:59:13.679 --> 00:59:19.400
behavioral modification done through certain psychological techniques. Well you can.

925
00:59:19.760 --> 00:59:24.679
You can modify your behavior, but that's there's nothing necessarily

926
00:59:24.760 --> 00:59:29.519
inherently spiritual about that. But the point is, no matter

927
00:59:29.559 --> 00:59:31.679
how much you modify your behavior, you're still in a

928
00:59:31.719 --> 00:59:35.320
perpetual status sin, and that doesn't have anything to do

929
00:59:35.400 --> 00:59:40.639
with what's going on inside of you. So when I

930
00:59:40.800 --> 00:59:44.480
saw some one o eight today and I read Oh God,

931
00:59:44.599 --> 00:59:48.320
my heart is steadfast, I wanted to get to the

932
00:59:48.360 --> 00:59:50.400
stead fast and fixed part and try to understand that.

933
00:59:50.719 --> 00:59:52.159
But as soon as I saw the heart, I'm like,

934
00:59:52.199 --> 00:59:54.760
well what is the heart? And once I start reading

935
00:59:54.760 --> 00:59:57.159
about the heart, I'm like, well, wait a minute, that

936
00:59:57.280 --> 00:59:59.199
sounds like the nature. Now. AI wants to draw a

937
00:59:59.239 --> 01:00:02.239
distinction between the heart and nature, but it's a distinction

938
01:00:02.519 --> 01:00:05.639
without a distinction. Really, it's so similar. I don't know

939
01:00:05.679 --> 01:00:08.159
how you can even separate that. Can you even really

940
01:00:08.280 --> 01:00:10.639
separate it? The best they could come up with is, well,

941
01:00:10.880 --> 01:00:14.159
the nature is static, the heart is always changing, and

942
01:00:14.760 --> 01:00:18.079
the nature is reflected in the heart. All right, you

943
01:00:18.199 --> 01:00:20.199
can play that game. If you want, here's what I

944
01:00:20.280 --> 01:00:23.840
will say. When you got saved, your heart didn't change

945
01:00:24.119 --> 01:00:27.119
and your nature didn't change. That's why you still sin.

946
01:00:31.519 --> 01:00:36.880
And that is not outside of historical Christianity. Let me

947
01:00:36.960 --> 01:00:39.280
state it again. I know I've said in the podcast

948
01:00:39.320 --> 01:00:41.519
that I feel like I'm getting further and further outside

949
01:00:41.519 --> 01:00:45.039
of Christianity, and I keep waiting to get an email.

950
01:00:45.119 --> 01:00:47.559
You know, hey, you can no longer broadcast on the

951
01:00:47.639 --> 01:00:50.719
sermon's two point oh app because you're outside of Christianity.

952
01:00:50.840 --> 01:00:53.360
I will argue, no, I am very much in the

953
01:00:53.480 --> 01:00:57.880
tradition of the reform, Calvinistic Lutheran position, even though those

954
01:00:57.960 --> 01:01:02.400
who are Calvinistic, Reformed and Lutheran have abandoned the very

955
01:01:02.519 --> 01:01:06.480
position that defined their entire movement. And why did it

956
01:01:06.840 --> 01:01:09.800
define their entire movement? They were fighting against a system

957
01:01:09.840 --> 01:01:13.800
that we're protesting against, the Catholic system that says that

958
01:01:13.960 --> 01:01:17.719
you are infused with righteousness, and the reformer said, no,

959
01:01:18.199 --> 01:01:22.400
we are not infused with righteousness. Righteousness is imputed to us.

960
01:01:22.679 --> 01:01:26.119
It doesn't change us, it changes our position. Well, if

961
01:01:26.159 --> 01:01:29.159
you believe you get a new heart and a new nature,

962
01:01:29.480 --> 01:01:32.440
ladies and gentlemen, then you have to believe you've been

963
01:01:32.480 --> 01:01:35.719
infused with righteousness because you now have a perfect heart

964
01:01:36.199 --> 01:01:39.639
and a perfect nature. So you have to believe righteousness

965
01:01:39.639 --> 01:01:42.400
has been infused in you. You believe, you believe you

966
01:01:42.519 --> 01:01:46.280
now have a sinful, a sinless heart, and a sinless nature.

967
01:01:46.599 --> 01:01:50.440
You've been infused with righteousness. You are returning to Catholicism.

968
01:01:51.440 --> 01:01:57.800
I reject Catholicism. I don't believe I was infused with righteousness.

969
01:01:58.159 --> 01:02:01.719
I believe righteous business was imputed to my account, and

970
01:02:01.800 --> 01:02:05.239
I was declared to be something that I am that

971
01:02:05.480 --> 01:02:10.440
I am not nor ever will be in this life.

972
01:02:13.119 --> 01:02:15.840
And whenever I read scripture that says do this, do this,

973
01:02:16.079 --> 01:02:19.159
do this, do this, I understand those scriptures to be law.

974
01:02:19.679 --> 01:02:22.920
I know I cannot keep those law that law, and

975
01:02:23.000 --> 01:02:25.840
that law exposes that I cannot do that, and that

976
01:02:26.000 --> 01:02:28.280
I'm still a sinner, and that I run to Christ,

977
01:02:28.480 --> 01:02:31.239
and I find that there is no condemnation in Christ Jesus.

978
01:02:31.360 --> 01:02:35.199
Why because by faith I'm declared to be that which

979
01:02:35.519 --> 01:02:38.840
I am not. Therefore I should remain humble, I should

980
01:02:38.880 --> 01:02:41.880
remain broken, I should remain dependent upon God's grace. And

981
01:02:41.880 --> 01:02:45.679
guess what else I should do? I should be able

982
01:02:45.719 --> 01:02:47.679
to be open and honest with who I really am

983
01:02:47.960 --> 01:02:55.920
instead of what I'm trying to pretend to be. Now there,

984
01:02:57.039 --> 01:03:02.840
somehow the solution is found. I'll let you unpack the rest.

985
01:03:03.159 --> 01:03:07.079
Thanks for listening. Everyone, have a great day. God bless