April 14, 2025

Are Christians Dead To Self? Pt 1

Are Christians Dead To Self? Pt 1

Are christians truly dead to self?

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Are christians truly dead to self?

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Looking at our world from a theological perspective. This is

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the Theology Central podcast, making Theology Central. Good afternoon, everyone.

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It is Monday, April the fourteenth, twenty twenty five. It

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is currently four forty five pm Central Time, and I'm

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coming to you live from the Theology Central studio located

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right here in Abilene, Texas. Now, I was debating with

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myself what should I call this episode? How should I

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move this forward? Because it's a continuation of all of

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the things we've been talking about in regards to well

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our Christians truly satisfied because we teach that Jesus is

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all we need and if we have Jesus and we

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have we have full satisfaction because Jesus satisfies every need.

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That's what Christians claim. I've chow that I've tried to

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talk about are we really satisfied? And so in some ways,

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since this is a continuation of that, I should just

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continue with calling this are Christians Satisfied? And make this

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part four. But I think this is a pivotal turning

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point because we're going to keep talking about this idea

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of satisfaction, but we're going to turn to something very

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almost fundamental to Christian teaching, and that's this idea of

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well dying to self. So I'm going to call this

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are Christians really dead? And hopefully this is all going

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to make sense. I think we'll have to do maybe

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two parts, three parts on this subject. So we're going

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to kind of start where we have been and then

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move this forward because in this episode, this is an

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episode that isn't about This is not about debating theology.

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This is an episode and all of this discussion about

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are Christians satisfied? It's really about being honest in fact,

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Over and over and over. I find that a lot

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of my episodes are about being truly honest with ourselves

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as Christians, getting away from the way Christianity is sold,

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getting away from all of the of how Christians pretend

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to be something they are not. There's so much pretense,

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there's so much pretend, there's so much dress up in Christianity.

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This is about stripping that all away and being very

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real and being very honest. This episode is about being

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about being honest about what it means to be human.

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This is an episode about us being honest about the

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deep needs we all carry. This is about us being

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honest about what happens when those needs aren't met. And

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this is about being brutally honest about the con fusing

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solution Christianity so often offers, which is, die to yourself.

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That's the solution. Hey, you've got needs. But if you

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can't meet these needs, just die to yourself. What if

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that solution isn't just incomplete? What if it's actually harmful?

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And what if the Gospel offers something far more honest,

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far more human, and far more helpful. Can we actually

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get to the gospel or has the Church and Christianity

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so hidden the Gospel but that nobody ever gets to

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the true thing. We offer all of these other things

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that we may somehow call it the gospel, but we've

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so added to that I think in many cases what

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we present is actually not even the real Gospel anymore.

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So I'm gonna drive I'm gonna start this by really

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trying to drive some very important concepts here right because

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I want us to start with an unshakable reality. I

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want us to start with an unshakable reality. It is

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real of you, it's real of you, it's real of me,

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it's real of anybody you know. And that is we

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are all built. We are all created with deep needs.

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I want to drive this home. We are creatures of

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design and dependence. We need as human beings, we have

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this need of love, this need of safety, this need

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of intimacy, this need of belonging, this need of purpose,

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of pleasure, of connection, of identity. Whether you like it

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or not, this is an unshakable human reality. We are

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built with deep needs. We are creatures of design and dependence.

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We need love, we need safety, we need intimacy, we

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need belonging, we need purpose, we need pleasure, we need connection,

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we need identity. And in many these needs in and

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of themselves are not selfish or part of the created

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human experience. And when these needs go unmet, they affect

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us psychologically, they affect us emotionally, they affect us physically,

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and they impact us spiritually. I'm going to give you

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some just brief examples. A child without love doesn't just

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feel lonely. They typically will develop behavioral disorders. An adult

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without meaning or connection many cases, find themselves turning to

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addiction or escapism or spiritual despair. And we've talked about

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Maslow's hierarchy of needs. We've talked about all of that.

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We've talked about the idea of self determination. We've talked about.

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We've talked about all of those things in all of

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the previous episodes, so I'm not gonna go back over

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all of those again, but we've really tried to drive

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those points home. So I want to just this unshakable

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human reality, the way we are created. We have these needs,

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they are deep inside of us, and if the needs

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don't are not met, problems begin. So that's an unshakable reality.

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Another thing I want you to understand is this desperate

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attempt to meet these real needs. But typically, and more

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frequently than we may want to admit, in wrong ways. See,

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sin isn't always just some random rebellion. It's just like, Oh,

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you just woke up some day and I'm just gonna

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rebel here. I'm just going to do this. It's often

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a short cut satisfaction. Lust equals a desire for connection

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and intimacy. Greed equals a desire for security, rage equals

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a desire for justice or power. Gluttony equals a desire

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for pleasure and comfort. In many cases, sin is a

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misdirection of legitimate longing, and this is at least something

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that has to be discussed In many cases, sin is

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a misdirection of a legitimate longing, a legitimate need, a

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legitimate desire. The desire, the need, the longing may be legitimate,

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but sin is the misdirection of that legitimate longing. And

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a lot of times this is not discussed in Christianity.

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Christianity sometimes is very surface, very much just throw wants

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to throw a band aid on things and Christianity and

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Christianity's answer is almost always the same, just stop it,

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don't do it, Just stop it. Read your bible more,

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go to church, more, pray more, do this, don't do this.

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We don't ever want to get into the deeper areas

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here we are built. We are created with these needs.

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When those needs go unmet, problems begin and we spend

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a good portion of our lives and a desperate attempt

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to meet these real needs. We become obsessed, preoccupied, focused

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on getting these needs met. And then add in, well,

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we have a sinful nature, and the sinful nature doesn't

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just desire wrongly, it distorts everything. We are born not

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just with needs, but with a will that wants to

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meet them apart from God's word, design and timing, so

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we have built in needs they're there, there's no denying it.

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Sin in many cases is simply the misdirection of these

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legitimate longings. And then you add into that mix an

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absolute depraved nature. That deprave nature not only will desire

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what God doesn't know, what God condemns or God forbids

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or God prohibits. Not only will the sinful nature want

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the wrong thing, it will even then want to pursue

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the right thing with the wrong way, or to try

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to get the right thing in the wrong way. You

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mix all of this together, we've got we've got a problem.

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We've got a major, major problem. So now listen, I

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want you to see this. We're painting a picture that

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we're not just needy, and we're very needy at our

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very essence, because we have all these needs and all

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these desires and all these ones. But we're corrupted, we're twisted,

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we're sinful. So we've got longings and desires, and if

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they don't get met, problems began. And then so sin

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and one essence of sin is the misdirection of legitimate longing.

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But then we have a sinful nature who then doesn't

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even have legitimate longing or will take the legitimate longing

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and tell you to go fulfill that legitimate longing and

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in a way that goes against God's word. Is that

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is a very piologically sound understanding of who we are

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as human beings that the church in many cases doesn't

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really want to talk about deeply. So how does the

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church typically respond to this? How does the church typically

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respond to this? Well, the Church's response is usually, now,

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there's a lot, there's a lot when it comes to

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the church. So I'm not trying to reduce that this

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is the only thing, but this is the one I

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really want to focus on here, right because obviously I'm

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calling this, you know, our Christians really dead to theirselves?

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Are Christians really dead? Because this is where the church goes.

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So the church takes that reality. Again. I don't know

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how much more I can stress that reality, but that's

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the reality. That is the reality that I have tried

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to paint and three what three hours plus and discussing

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Christians and satisfaction. We have these desires. Sin is the

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misdirection for this. These longings may be right, but sin

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is the misdirection. It's attempting to fulfill these longings in

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an incorrect way. Add in a sinful nature, and the

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sinful nature not only has wrong desires, it will tell

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you to go get the right desires the wrong way.

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And so we are in a mess. We're in a total,

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complete mess as human beings. And the Church then kind

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of steps in. Christianity sees this chaos. It sees all

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of this messed up situation. It sees the internal war,

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it sees the need and the sin, it sees all

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of that. It realizes, man, things look, this is what

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God's word says, and we well, whether Christianity wants to

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truly diagnose the problem. It acknowledges that things aren't right.

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So Christianity will again, there's many ways that will approach it. Well.

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One of the ways Christianity, especially when dealing with Christians,

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will step in and say something like this, just die

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to yourself, just deny your desires, stop following you and

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follow Christ. That sounds so good, right, that sounds wonderful.

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Just die to yourself, deny your desires, stop following yourself

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and follow Christ. That sounds good. It sounds biblical, it

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sounds scriptural, it sounds philological. And the Church will say amen.

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So the Church will look at all these people who

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have these built in desires that they didn't ask for,

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that they're born with. You have these desires, right, and

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then you're use And if if you don't get these

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desires mad, everything you're not only you're not satisfied. It's

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going to cause all kinds of problems, physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually,

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all kinds of problems. So then many cases, our sin

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is simply us pursuing legitimate desires but the wrong way.

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And then you add into that our sinful desire, our

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sinful nature. We're a mess. And the church says, okay, okay, okay.

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Now the church some cases won't really acknowledge how deeply

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this goes, but they'll just say, hey, die to yourself,

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take up your cross and die, and then all the

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problems are solved, right, I mean, if I could truly

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die to myself. Can you imagine what life would look

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like if we could truly die to ourselves, if we

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could truly deny ourselves, if we could truly stop following

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ourselves and following Christ. It does sound biblical, it does

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sound spiritual, but what does that actually mean? What does

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it look like? And has anyone else I've ever really

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done it? So we've talked about Christians. Are they really satisfied?

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My emphatic answer is absolutely not, because if you only

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miss one or two, if someone's just missing a couple

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of those things, they're not really satisfied. We talked about

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a lot of the hypocrisy and Christianity about this, but

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now let's just take the time to deal with this

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whole subject of dying to self. And we're going to

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approach this in kind of a long and winding road

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because I like to bring you into the conversations that

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I have about these things that I've been thinking about

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so late at night, early morning, right, I don't even know,

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four in the morning, three in the morning. The next thing,

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you know, I find myself thinking about this dying to self,

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dying to self, dying to self, all of these issues.

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And I'm like, well, let me talk to artificial intelligence.

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So I said, hey, AI, we need to talk. And

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so I'm going to share much of my conversation with

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artificial intelligence and regards to this subject because we spend

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a lot of time working on this, all right. So

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I started by asking, basically saying this to AI. And

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I usually write like long paragraphs, So I said this

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to AI. If we take the die deny and follow

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the way most of Christianity teaches it. So die to self,

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deny self, follow Christ, don't follow self. If we take

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this the way most of Christianity teaches it, doesn't it

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all become very subjective. The more of the needs and

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desires you can have met in this life, the less

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you have to die to yourself, the less you have

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to deny yourself, the less you have to stop following yourself.

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But for those missing many of those things, they have

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to die, die to self, deny self, and struggle not

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to follow in a far greater way. Now, why did

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I start the conversation here, Because in our conversation about

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are Christians satisfied? I think there's a game that Christians play,

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and I think it's ridiculous, and Christians never want to

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acknowledge this. But Christianity likes to sell this idea that, hey,

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when you come to Jesus and you get Jesus, you've

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got all that you need, all your needs are met,

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you've got everything, you are satisfied, You're never going to

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hunger and thirst again. You've got everything, you don't need

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anything else. You could lose everything and have perfect peace

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and be completely content because you've got Jesus. You preach

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that in church, everybody says amen. But then you look

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at the congregation. You look at the makeup of the congregation,

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and almost the majority of the congregation, without fail, they're married.

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Many of them are young couples or they're now much older,

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and you kind of look at that. You know, like,

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uh huh, let me see, you're married, you have you

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have a house, you have a car, you have a job.

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Especially the younger couples, you're right in that stage where

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you're working on this and you're and you're excited about

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your career. You're trying to advance in your career. You

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maybe trying to get an additional education. You've got goals,

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you've got purpose, you've got desire, you've got excitement. For

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the most part, you've got your health. You've got health,

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you've got family, you've got relationship, you've got intimacy, you

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have physical uh, pleasure, You've got all of these things.

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And then you're gonna be like, Jesus is all I need.

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Jesus satisfies You talk a big game, but you got everything.

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You got everything, And then you look to everyone else

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who may not have those things. And remember what happens

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as soon as you don't have one of the things

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in Maslow's hierarchy of needs, one of those basic desires

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not being met. Someone things start going wrong mentally, emotionally, physically,

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things are not going to be right for them, and

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the Churchill will be, Hey, all you need is Jesus.

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You should be satisfied. But it's such a game. Oh yeah,

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now you say that. Now you say that because you've

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got almost everything on Mileslow's hierarchy of needs. You've almost

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got it all. So stop talking a big game like

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you've got it that. Oh you're just so comfortable with Jesus.

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Of course you're comfortable with Jesus because you've got almost

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every need met. Now go talk to that person alone, alone, No,

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no physical intimacy, no emotional intimacy, no, no, no physical intimacy, intimacy,

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no physical satisfaction. They got this. They don't have this.

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They don't have financial stability. They're missing this, they're missing that.

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They don't have this they're suffering of physically. Now go

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tell them, Jesus is all you need. Do you not

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hear yourself? You're telling someone who's missing. They don't have

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half of what you have. That maybe down sixty seventy

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percent of what you don't have. Now you're telling them

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be content because they've got Jesus what you sit around

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having everything on Moslow's hierarchy of needs. Just stop talking.

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And I talked about how this plays out within Christianity

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right now. A lot of times what happens is you'll

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have people they get about fifteen, sixteen seventeen, Well, now

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they got desires, they got wants, they got desires, they

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got wants, right, and the church will say, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't,

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don't don't. You can't fulfill those desires. You can only

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do it God's way. You can only do it God's way.

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And so in many cases that leads to people getting

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married at a very very young age because hey, you

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can't do that, you can't do that, you can't do that,

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so you gotta get married. So maybe they get married

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at eighteen nineteen. Many cases, these marriages completely implode and

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fall apart. Okay, but because in many cases they're getting

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married because of oh, well, it's better to get married

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than to burn, So I gotta do this. So that

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I don't commit sin. So it's all about getting married

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so that you don't commit sin. But in many cases

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you rush into the marriage just so that you're not

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committing sin. And in many cases then you're yeah, you

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don't even know if you made the right decision, but hey,

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you made the right decision because you didn't commit sin. Well,

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this leads to sometimes while all the problems that can

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arise later. But in many cases what happens is people

305
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they will struggle between maybe fifteen, sixteen, seventeen, eighteen, nineteen,

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twenty twenty one. They're struggling, maybe with premarital sex, pornography, this,

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maybe they're dating an unbeliever. There's all of these issues

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that they're struggling with, right, they're struggling. They're struggling. They're struggling,

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and what do many of them do. They leave the church.

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They pull back from the church. They're not involved in

311
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the church, avoiding church discipline, avoiding any problems, avoiding any difficulty.

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They go away because they have all these needs and

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all these desires that are not being met and they

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can't be mad unless they end up in the right context.

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And what do many of them do. They disappear only

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to show back up, only to show back up once

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they get married. Now they're married, they have a kid

318
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on the way, and all of a sudden, Jesus is important.

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Jesus is my savior. Oh I was off in soin,

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but now I've got Jesus and he's all I need.

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And I love my Jesus. And they talk a big game,

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and they act all spiritual sitting in the pew. In

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many cases they're arrogant and condemning and judgmental. Well, of course, now,

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of course you can talk a big game now, right.

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You're not looking for intimacy. You get to have intimacy.

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You're not looking for physical pleasure. You get to experience it.

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You've got emotional intimate, physical intimacy. You got a family,

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you got a job, you've got a career. You're pursuing this,

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you're excited about that. You've got some friends, You've got this.

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You come to church because you can meet more friends

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and have more community, which just happens to be a need.

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But now you can meet it in the church. You

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get to go do activities, and you've got hobbies, and

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you got this, and you're buying this, and maybe you're

335
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working on your house or you're getting a new house.

336
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You've got goals, you got purpose, you got passion, you

337
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got zeal, you got your health, and now all of

338
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a sudden you're the good Christian, but everyone else you're

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like no, no, no, no, no no no no no no no.

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So I just think it's all there's so much a

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facade here, and nobody wants to ever address this. So

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then I was in a take. That's why I then

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asked this question. Well, wait, if we take this, Oh,

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you've got to die to yourself, deny yourself, and no

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longer follow your follow self the way most Christians teach it. Well,

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then it becomes very subjective. The more of your needs

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on Massolow's hierarchy of needs, the more they are met,

348
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The more of those desires you can have met in life. Well,

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then the less you have to die, the less you

350
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have to pay, the less it's going to cost you.

351
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The less you have to deny, the less you have

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to stop following self. So I asked Ai about this,

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and AI said, this, You've just hit on one of

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the most profound, underrecognized problems, and how the modern church

355
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preaches that die, deny, follow message and I was like, whoa,

356
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AI just says, I just stumbled upon one of the

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most profound, underrecognized problems and how the modern church presents

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die to self, deny self, stop following self. AI then

359
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puts it together in a paragraph. When deny yourself, take

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up your cross and follow Jesus as taught as an

361
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ongoing lifestyle requirement for Christians. Without the framework of law, gospel,

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and positional identity in Christ, then yes, it becomes entirely subjective,

363
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inconsistently applied, and often deeply tied to one's life's circumstances.

364
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Let me give you an example. Let me give you

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an example. Give you an example. Now, many Christians are

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going to debate this, but I think I look, when

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it comes to we'll just get blunt here when it

368
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comes to say physical attraction or sexual desire. Right, let's

369
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just just go with me, at least hypothetically. You may

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disagree with this, but I think you can just say

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people have different physical desires and different levels of desires

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and different needs, and nobody can just say, well, where

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did this come from? Why do I It's a part

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of us. So let's just say because people are born sinful,

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that many of let's say, so many of those desires

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could be then sinful. I mean it makes sense because

377
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we're sinners, so it means many of our desires and

378
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any of our wants could be sinful because we're born sinful.

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So because people are born sinful, then I don't think

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it's out of the realm. Philologically speaking, I think it's

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very possible, and I think it's even probable that then

382
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some could be born with desires of a same sex attraction.

383
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That's all. They're not attracted at all to the opposite sex.

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They can't even imagine physical intimacy with someone of the

385
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opposite sex. They're not attracted to it, do not have

386
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any desire, but they still have the same level of

387
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desire for intimacy and for connection and for physical pleasure,

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just like you do for someone of the opposite sex. Now,

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they're born this way. They didn't ask for this, they're

390
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born this way, and they have this because the need

391
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and desire for intimacy, connection and physical pleasure. We're all

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born with it. I mean, it well develops obviously when

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we reach a certain age and that it become for

394
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love and intimacy. That's there, But you get the idea.

395
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The sexual desire obviously then becomes more recognized as we

396
00:25:59.519 --> 00:26:02.319
get older puberty and you understand, I'm not gonna have

397
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to tell you the whole way it works, but you

398
00:26:04.240 --> 00:26:07.880
get the basic idea. So here they are. They've got

399
00:26:07.880 --> 00:26:11.519
the same needs you and I have for love, for intimacy,

400
00:26:11.599 --> 00:26:14.759
for desire. They've got it. It's burning inside of them,

401
00:26:14.799 --> 00:26:17.359
just like it burns inside of everyone else, right, but

402
00:26:17.960 --> 00:26:20.519
for them, and we can blame it on their sinful nature.

403
00:26:20.559 --> 00:26:24.319
We can. They only can see this being fulfilled. They

404
00:26:24.319 --> 00:26:26.880
only want this being fulfilled someone of the same sex.

405
00:26:29.240 --> 00:26:31.079
Now we know what Christian is going to say, Well,

406
00:26:31.079 --> 00:26:33.599
you got to deny self, die to self, and you

407
00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:35.279
just can't do that. You just have to live your

408
00:26:35.319 --> 00:26:37.400
life without it. You have to live your life alone.

409
00:26:37.519 --> 00:26:39.799
You just have to live your life without that intimacy,

410
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:42.440
no physical pleasure. You have to be celibate. You have

411
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to abstain for the rest of your life. Now that's

412
00:26:48.640 --> 00:26:53.160
easy for you to say, holding your husband's hand, holding

413
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your wife's hand, walking into your car, arm around each other,

414
00:27:00.640 --> 00:27:02.599
you get in the car, you kiss each other, you

415
00:27:02.680 --> 00:27:05.519
go home. You can be together intimately while the other

416
00:27:05.559 --> 00:27:10.359
person goes home alone. Well, they need to die to self. Yeah,

417
00:27:10.599 --> 00:27:27.559
well you don't have to. Nobody wants to ever discuss this.

418
00:27:27.559 --> 00:27:34.279
This becomes very complicated, so AI says there's a hidden

419
00:27:34.359 --> 00:27:38.480
injustice in the way Christianity teaches die, deny, and follow.

420
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Ai says this, the more your needs are met, the

421
00:27:44.359 --> 00:27:48.880
less you have to deny. If you're married, if you're

422
00:27:48.920 --> 00:27:52.839
financially stable, if your love and supported, if you're secure

423
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in your identity and purpose, then your faith often feels

424
00:27:56.119 --> 00:28:02.559
like confirmation of your blessings. Oh God is good. God

425
00:28:02.680 --> 00:28:07.240
is so good, He's so great. I'm blessed, blessed beyond measure.

426
00:28:07.559 --> 00:28:11.839
Oh my life is so good. So what do you

427
00:28:11.880 --> 00:28:20.200
have to deny? What is it costing you? You could

428
00:28:20.240 --> 00:28:23.519
say something, I've died to self and now look what

429
00:28:23.599 --> 00:28:26.240
God has done for me. You can almost see that

430
00:28:26.359 --> 00:28:28.920
all of your blessings is a reward because you died

431
00:28:28.920 --> 00:28:31.519
to yourself, so you get all of this. Maybe the

432
00:28:31.599 --> 00:28:33.640
reason other people don't have all that you have is

433
00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:36.880
because they didn't die to yourself. Well, so so happy

434
00:28:36.920 --> 00:28:39.079
for you, so you get your pat yourself on the back.

435
00:28:39.119 --> 00:28:40.880
I guess on how godly you are. Some may not

436
00:28:40.920 --> 00:28:43.440
go that direction, but you can see what this starts

437
00:28:43.480 --> 00:28:50.440
to set up. So you get to say all of this,

438
00:28:50.559 --> 00:28:52.880
you get to celebrate all of this, and this is

439
00:28:52.880 --> 00:28:58.359
what AI says. But you haven't had to deny. You

440
00:28:58.440 --> 00:29:04.039
haven't had to deny your heartbreaking loneliness. You hadn't had

441
00:29:04.039 --> 00:29:08.920
to deny celibacy. You hadn't have to deny isolation. You

442
00:29:08.920 --> 00:29:11.920
don't have to deny poverty, you don't have to deny

443
00:29:12.279 --> 00:29:18.799
mental torment. You just had to give up bad habits

444
00:29:18.880 --> 00:29:24.079
or surface level indulgences, not core God given desires that

445
00:29:24.160 --> 00:29:28.799
go unmet year after year after year after year after

446
00:29:28.920 --> 00:29:33.720
year after year after year, maybe forever. No no, no, no, no, no,

447
00:29:33.759 --> 00:29:39.519
you don't have to do that. There's an imbalance, there's

448
00:29:39.519 --> 00:29:42.559
an injustice in the way this plays out. Now, I

449
00:29:42.599 --> 00:29:45.279
know what others are gonna say, Well, God is just sovereign.

450
00:29:45.519 --> 00:29:49.880
God is just sovereign. Sorry you were molested for fifteen years. Sorry,

451
00:29:50.799 --> 00:29:56.880
God is just sovereign. I wasn't. Now. I know. You

452
00:29:56.920 --> 00:29:59.640
don't say it in such a blunt way as I

453
00:29:59.759 --> 00:30:02.880
just described it, but that's how it ultimately plays out.

454
00:30:02.880 --> 00:30:07.759
In the way Christians talk, well, or we make every excuse, Yeah,

455
00:30:07.799 --> 00:30:17.200
you make every excuse because you didn't experience it. Okay.

456
00:30:19.000 --> 00:30:21.279
So AI's like, the more your needs are met, the

457
00:30:21.359 --> 00:30:23.480
less you have to deny. Ai goes on to say,

458
00:30:23.599 --> 00:30:26.200
the less you have, the more you're told to die.

459
00:30:27.279 --> 00:30:30.519
The less you have, the more you're told to die.

460
00:30:30.599 --> 00:30:35.640
If you're single and longing for companionship, die deny, let go.

461
00:30:36.519 --> 00:30:41.359
If you're childless and grieving, die deny and let go.

462
00:30:41.640 --> 00:30:45.880
If you're unemployed and directionless, die deny and let go.

463
00:30:46.079 --> 00:30:50.480
If you're battling trauma, depression, and instability, die deny and

464
00:30:50.559 --> 00:30:55.559
let go. You're often told deny yourself. Don't desire those

465
00:30:55.559 --> 00:30:58.599
things too much. Jesus is enough. Die to your dreams,

466
00:30:58.720 --> 00:31:02.799
don't follow your feelings, just take up your cross. The

467
00:31:02.880 --> 00:31:06.599
message becomes you must die harder because you lack more.

468
00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:11.839
It's almost a cruel theology, even if it's unintentional. That's

469
00:31:11.880 --> 00:31:14.400
where we end up and we don't hear what we're saying.

470
00:31:14.440 --> 00:31:16.960
We don't here, we don't we don't take it to

471
00:31:17.039 --> 00:31:26.400
its logical conclusion. And this can even become more bizarre

472
00:31:26.440 --> 00:31:29.960
in the way it can play out. Right, it's so weird, right, okay,

473
00:31:31.200 --> 00:31:33.359
just just I know I'm about to get into some

474
00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:35.799
controversial stuff. But we've got I told you, I'm not

475
00:31:35.799 --> 00:31:38.799
here to debate theology. I'm here to be very, very honest.

476
00:31:38.960 --> 00:31:41.079
So let's let this play out in a couple of

477
00:31:41.079 --> 00:31:43.160
different directions. The way this can play out because the

478
00:31:43.279 --> 00:31:46.759
church plays so many twisted games on this. Okay, So

479
00:31:47.640 --> 00:31:51.039
if you're single, right, you're single, you're not married, so

480
00:31:51.119 --> 00:31:55.640
you don't you have no ability for then physical intimacy, right,

481
00:31:55.680 --> 00:31:58.839
You're you're forbidden from having it. So you're supposed to abstain.

482
00:31:59.000 --> 00:32:02.720
You're supposed to die to yourself. You're supposed to deny yourself.

483
00:32:02.799 --> 00:32:05.319
You're you're not supposed to engage in that in any way,

484
00:32:05.319 --> 00:32:06.880
shape or form. You're not to look at a woman

485
00:32:06.920 --> 00:32:09.079
with lush, You're not to look at porn. You're not.

486
00:32:09.400 --> 00:32:14.359
You're supposed to just abstain, abstain, abstain, abstain, abstain. That's

487
00:32:14.359 --> 00:32:17.039
what you're supposed to do. Right, So you're supposed to

488
00:32:17.079 --> 00:32:20.039
die to yourself. You're supposed to deny yourself. Now, all

489
00:32:20.119 --> 00:32:22.640
the married people there, hey, they're good to go. They

490
00:32:22.640 --> 00:32:24.880
don't have to deny themselves. They get they get to

491
00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:27.200
they get to particular people say, well, that's just the

492
00:32:27.200 --> 00:32:29.160
way it works. But just wait, what what's the way

493
00:32:29.200 --> 00:32:31.480
this what's the way this plays out? Because there's a

494
00:32:31.480 --> 00:32:33.960
little bit of hypocrisy here, right, So they don't have

495
00:32:34.039 --> 00:32:36.799
to die, they don't have to deny, they can indulge.

496
00:32:36.839 --> 00:32:39.279
They can indulge, they can get as much as they

497
00:32:39.319 --> 00:32:42.359
want and there's no sin. So they're good to go.

498
00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:45.440
Now everybody else, sorry, sorry you can't. Oh but wait, now,

499
00:32:45.519 --> 00:32:48.359
let's see how this plays out. Some of those married

500
00:32:48.359 --> 00:32:55.279
people end up getting divorced. No, wait, they didn't deny themselves.

501
00:32:55.480 --> 00:32:58.000
They didn't die to themselves. Because if both if you

502
00:32:58.079 --> 00:33:00.000
die to yourself, you deny yourself, it's going to be

503
00:33:00.039 --> 00:33:02.799
very hard to get a divorce because that sounds like now,

504
00:33:02.839 --> 00:33:05.200
unless someone just leaves you, I guess then in that case,

505
00:33:05.319 --> 00:33:08.279
it's not on you. But the point is a divorce occurs. Now,

506
00:33:08.359 --> 00:33:13.880
here's what happens. Even if you allow for the supposed

507
00:33:13.960 --> 00:33:17.440
exception clause, which some people believe, there's certain exceptions where

508
00:33:17.480 --> 00:33:19.960
you cannot only get divorced. You're allowed to get divorced,

509
00:33:20.079 --> 00:33:22.480
you're allowed to get remarried. Oh watch the way this

510
00:33:22.559 --> 00:33:25.880
game is played, right, So some people will say that

511
00:33:25.920 --> 00:33:29.319
there's an exception clause. Others don't believe there's an exception clause.

512
00:33:29.480 --> 00:33:32.279
But guess what. People who don't believe there's an exception

513
00:33:32.400 --> 00:33:35.400
clause many cases, change their mind dramatically when they find

514
00:33:35.400 --> 00:33:38.440
themselves getting divorced, and all of a sudden, they say,

515
00:33:38.440 --> 00:33:40.480
there's an exception clause, and we'll find a way to

516
00:33:40.519 --> 00:33:43.039
say that the other person broke the exception clause so now,

517
00:33:43.119 --> 00:33:45.599
or that the exception clause applies in their particular case.

518
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:49.079
But whether it applies or don't apply, And many would argue,

519
00:33:49.519 --> 00:33:52.680
even if the divorce is allowed, is remarriage allowed. Many

520
00:33:52.720 --> 00:33:55.200
in church history would say, no, remarriage is not allowed.

521
00:33:55.240 --> 00:33:58.119
You have to now remain single as long as your

522
00:33:58.119 --> 00:34:00.640
spouse is still alive. Now you have to remain single,

523
00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:03.240
and you have to remain celibate. Right, So some will

524
00:34:03.279 --> 00:34:06.119
be like, okay, I can't. Some churches will even say

525
00:34:06.200 --> 00:34:08.920
you can't get remarried. You can't do this, and they're like, okay,

526
00:34:09.039 --> 00:34:12.039
so I have now. So if you're single, you got

527
00:34:12.320 --> 00:34:17.280
no physical intimacy, you're missing out on all of that.

528
00:34:17.360 --> 00:34:19.840
You can't have it right. Oh, now now you've got divorced.

529
00:34:19.880 --> 00:34:21.920
Now some will say, well, you've got to remain single.

530
00:34:22.000 --> 00:34:23.920
Now you've got to go without for the rest of

531
00:34:23.960 --> 00:34:28.079
your life. All right, okay, all right, but almost inevitably,

532
00:34:28.920 --> 00:34:33.280
and every church you've got people sitting in that congregation,

533
00:34:34.400 --> 00:34:36.639
not only were they single at one point in time,

534
00:34:37.280 --> 00:34:41.079
many times during their single life, nobody may know it,

535
00:34:41.159 --> 00:34:45.159
maybe top secret. They weren't so self denying as they

536
00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:48.159
that everyone may think they were. They actually were engaged

537
00:34:48.199 --> 00:34:50.679
in some kind of sin during that time, but sh

538
00:34:50.960 --> 00:34:54.800
nobody knows. Right then they got married, Okay, they Now

539
00:34:54.800 --> 00:34:56.840
it's good because then their sin is never going to

540
00:34:56.840 --> 00:34:59.119
be found out because now they're married. Okay, good, right,

541
00:34:59.320 --> 00:35:07.320
they got divorce and then they got remarried. Now, throughout

542
00:35:07.360 --> 00:35:11.280
history it would be like, wait a minute, you're divorced

543
00:35:11.360 --> 00:35:16.760
and remarried. Now if it doesn't meet the exception clause,

544
00:35:16.960 --> 00:35:19.320
or even if it does meet the exception clause, according

545
00:35:19.320 --> 00:35:24.360
to some theologies, you're like, huh, I think this then

546
00:35:24.400 --> 00:35:28.199
would be classified as an adulterous relationship. Every time you

547
00:35:28.239 --> 00:35:31.639
come together, you're committing adultery because the other spouse is

548
00:35:31.639 --> 00:35:34.719
still alive. So you are supposed to be what God

549
00:35:34.800 --> 00:35:38.280
joins together. Let no man put asunder. You made a commitment,

550
00:35:39.119 --> 00:35:41.960
you made vowels. No, I'm sorry, you're going to have

551
00:35:42.000 --> 00:35:46.400
to abstain. You cannot engage in physical intimacy even though

552
00:35:46.440 --> 00:35:49.880
you're married, because it's adultery and we are against adultery,

553
00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:52.800
so you can't do that. Is that ever applied in

554
00:35:52.800 --> 00:35:56.239
certain parts in church history? It was, but through most

555
00:35:56.239 --> 00:35:59.280
of Christianity abandoned that, and like no, no, no, no, dice,

556
00:35:59.280 --> 00:36:01.639
because divorce became more and more common, and you have

557
00:36:01.719 --> 00:36:04.000
more and more churches filled with people who used to

558
00:36:04.079 --> 00:36:07.920
be married, got divorced, and they're remarried. They're involved in adultrey.

559
00:36:08.000 --> 00:36:09.760
And guess what they get to do. They get to

560
00:36:09.760 --> 00:36:22.280
commit adult tree Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday.

561
00:36:22.400 --> 00:36:24.159
They get to do so now wait wait wait wait

562
00:36:24.199 --> 00:36:27.440
wait those single people, those single no no no, no, no, no, no, no,

563
00:36:27.440 --> 00:36:29.199
no no no no, you can't. Yeah, that's a sin.

564
00:36:29.440 --> 00:36:32.320
That's that's fornication. You better not. Oh you better not

565
00:36:32.360 --> 00:36:34.599
be looking at that. You better not. Wait a minute,

566
00:36:34.760 --> 00:36:38.519
they're divorced, married and remarried. Are that's an adult. It

567
00:36:38.519 --> 00:36:41.079
doesn't matter. We don't look over there, you can't do it.

568
00:36:41.400 --> 00:36:44.280
Oh well, isn't that interesting. So they have to die

569
00:36:44.519 --> 00:36:47.239
and deny, but they don't have to die and deny.

570
00:36:48.679 --> 00:36:51.559
It kind of weird how Christianity can play this weird game.

571
00:36:52.280 --> 00:36:55.440
Oh wait, but in some cases some people, well you

572
00:36:55.639 --> 00:36:58.039
just you just got divorced. You can't You've got to

573
00:36:58.039 --> 00:37:02.119
remain single. So sometimes you have some who literally was divorced,

574
00:37:02.119 --> 00:37:05.039
they're remarried, they're an adultrey, and that someone else who's

575
00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:07.440
got divorced, but they're told they can't remarry and they

576
00:37:07.480 --> 00:37:10.239
have to stay they have to stay single and celibate.

577
00:37:10.280 --> 00:37:12.320
Well wait a minute, what about the people who literally

578
00:37:12.440 --> 00:37:16.440
broke every rule, got married, got divorced, got remarried. But

579
00:37:16.519 --> 00:37:19.559
they get to engage. They don't have to deny themselves.

580
00:37:21.360 --> 00:37:24.199
If if other people have to deny, then they should

581
00:37:24.239 --> 00:37:26.079
have to deny. Oh but we're not going to do that.

582
00:37:26.239 --> 00:37:29.679
Oh and then to add all of this in, Oh wait,

583
00:37:29.920 --> 00:37:31.880
if you have same sex attraction, you've got to live

584
00:37:31.920 --> 00:37:35.079
your life deny and deny and deny. Well wait a minute,

585
00:37:35.119 --> 00:37:37.519
but the person who was married, got divorced and got remarried,

586
00:37:37.639 --> 00:37:40.480
they don't. So the best thing to do in most cases,

587
00:37:40.679 --> 00:37:43.480
if you're a Christian and things aren't going right, leave

588
00:37:43.519 --> 00:37:46.119
the church, get divorced, get remarried, come back to the church,

589
00:37:46.119 --> 00:37:48.440
and you'll be welcome with open arms. You won't even

590
00:37:48.440 --> 00:37:50.280
be considered a sinner, and then you can have all

591
00:37:50.320 --> 00:37:58.159
the intimacy you want. The whole thing is a facility.

592
00:37:58.280 --> 00:38:04.079
It's such a game. So you can be sitting in

593
00:38:04.079 --> 00:38:08.800
a church. You can have in that church people who

594
00:38:08.840 --> 00:38:13.079
are who were married, divorced and remarried and possibly biblically

595
00:38:13.440 --> 00:38:16.679
and many of those cases literally are an adulterous relationship.

596
00:38:17.039 --> 00:38:18.840
They're never going to be judged and they're never going

597
00:38:18.920 --> 00:38:22.679
to be told to abstain, and they're perfectly okay in

598
00:38:22.719 --> 00:38:26.159
that very same church. If two of the singles get

599
00:38:26.239 --> 00:38:29.840
caught and involved in primarial sex, they could be church disciplined.

600
00:38:33.039 --> 00:38:35.320
They're gonna be church disciplined by the very church that

601
00:38:35.400 --> 00:38:37.599
has people sitting in the church who could be involved

602
00:38:37.639 --> 00:38:42.079
in an adulterous relationship. That's kind of odd, huh, and now

603
00:38:42.079 --> 00:38:46.199
weird that adultery is okay, that fornication is not. Oh,

604
00:38:46.400 --> 00:38:48.760
and in that same church, there could be two people

605
00:38:48.840 --> 00:38:51.079
who struggle with same sex attraction. If they get found out,

606
00:38:51.119 --> 00:38:52.840
they'll be booted and kicked out of the church. Well,

607
00:38:52.880 --> 00:38:55.440
you have people sitting in the church or an adulterous relationship.

608
00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:00.199
They don't have to die, They don't have you have

609
00:39:00.199 --> 00:39:11.480
to deny everyone else does? Oh? Do we want to

610
00:39:11.480 --> 00:39:16.599
make this even more uncomfortable? Do you want to make

611
00:39:16.639 --> 00:39:23.400
this really more uncomfortable? Now, I'm not going to say

612
00:39:23.559 --> 00:39:27.719
that weight is always the result of gluttony. By no way,

613
00:39:27.760 --> 00:39:30.239
shape or form. Am I going to say that. But

614
00:39:30.360 --> 00:39:32.840
in every church you either have people who are overweight

615
00:39:32.920 --> 00:39:35.119
as a result of gluttony, or you may have people

616
00:39:35.119 --> 00:39:38.079
who are single, but they're full blown gluttons by any

617
00:39:38.119 --> 00:39:41.880
definition of gluttony. Does any of the people involved in

618
00:39:41.920 --> 00:39:46.039
gluttony ever have to die deny? No? Will they ever

619
00:39:46.119 --> 00:39:48.960
even be shamed for it? No, will they ever be

620
00:39:49.039 --> 00:39:52.719
confronted about it. No, So you can engage in gluttony,

621
00:39:53.400 --> 00:39:56.119
which is a complete lack of you know, you're not

622
00:39:56.320 --> 00:39:59.960
dying and denying, you're indulging. You're going above and beyond,

623
00:40:00.280 --> 00:40:03.320
and you're okay. But but if you do that, well

624
00:40:03.559 --> 00:40:06.280
you've got to die and deny that, die and deny

625
00:40:06.440 --> 00:40:08.440
thing is just thrown out there whenever we want to

626
00:40:08.440 --> 00:40:10.079
throw it out, and we can apply it to whomever

627
00:40:10.119 --> 00:40:20.559
we want. It's such a game, so the less you have.

628
00:40:20.800 --> 00:40:24.000
If you're in some situations, you've got to die and deny.

629
00:40:24.119 --> 00:40:26.079
But the church will play these weird games, and other

630
00:40:26.119 --> 00:40:29.159
situations you're good to go. Nobody ever stops to go.

631
00:40:29.199 --> 00:40:32.840
Wait a minute, are we even listening to ourselves? How

632
00:40:32.880 --> 00:40:37.400
this is being applied? This seems so it's so subjective.

633
00:40:46.079 --> 00:40:49.320
So AI says, this all makes cross bearing and just

634
00:40:49.519 --> 00:40:53.960
dying ofself entirely subjective. Under this model, one person's cross

635
00:40:54.159 --> 00:41:01.320
is giving up Starbucks, another person's Another person's is crushing

636
00:41:01.440 --> 00:41:13.440
loneliness for life and sexual deprivation. You're deprived of it

637
00:41:13.599 --> 00:41:15.440
for the rest of your life. This person just has

638
00:41:15.480 --> 00:41:18.880
to try to give up Starbucks. Wow, wait to carry

639
00:41:18.920 --> 00:41:27.000
that cross way to die to yourself. One person gives

640
00:41:27.079 --> 00:41:30.119
up Netflix, the other has to give up the dream

641
00:41:30.159 --> 00:41:36.159
of being a parent. The language is used interchangeably, but

642
00:41:36.199 --> 00:41:39.880
the reality is wildly unequal, and those who suffer more

643
00:41:40.000 --> 00:41:43.320
are told to spiritualize their pain as discipleship, while those

644
00:41:43.320 --> 00:41:47.400
who suffer less are congratulated for denying themselves because they

645
00:41:48.280 --> 00:41:54.599
tithe or serve at the church. So Ai says, this

646
00:41:54.679 --> 00:41:59.199
all leads to some philological consequences. Becomes almost a work

647
00:41:59.239 --> 00:42:04.000
based bring in self management. Deny yourself becomes a performance treadmill.

648
00:42:04.480 --> 00:42:07.840
How much have you denied? How you have you died

649
00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:11.320
enough for your desires? Are you following him sincerely enough?

650
00:42:11.559 --> 00:42:15.519
It removes objective assurance and replaces it with emotional subjectivity.

651
00:42:15.880 --> 00:42:18.880
You feel close to God when you deny. Denying, well,

652
00:42:18.960 --> 00:42:22.360
you feel guilty when when you desire something, or you

653
00:42:22.639 --> 00:42:25.760
feel inferior when others seem more fulfilled or less needy.

654
00:42:25.880 --> 00:42:29.920
And it just becomes a subjective befom its base and

655
00:42:29.960 --> 00:42:42.599
it becomes a mess. This is where the church leads

656
00:42:42.639 --> 00:42:53.440
into this chaos, Ai says. So it becomes subjective and unjust.

657
00:42:54.320 --> 00:42:57.559
Those with much to enjoy don't have to deny as much,

658
00:42:57.960 --> 00:43:03.440
and their faith seems easier. Without much must deny more

659
00:43:03.800 --> 00:43:07.039
fundamental longings and are told to call that contentment. It

660
00:43:07.079 --> 00:43:10.840
becomes a moving target, a quiet judgment system, and deeply

661
00:43:10.960 --> 00:43:24.880
unequal theology. So Me and Ai continued to discuss. So

662
00:43:24.960 --> 00:43:28.440
Ai was acknowledging this thing is problematic, and I just

663
00:43:28.440 --> 00:43:32.559
pointed out some very really just inconsistent, weird ways this

664
00:43:32.639 --> 00:43:35.719
plays out and Christianity. And whenever you pointed out, people

665
00:43:35.719 --> 00:43:38.599
get mad at me. They get irritated with me, but

666
00:43:38.679 --> 00:43:42.039
don't get mad with me, I think to me, I

667
00:43:42.079 --> 00:43:44.639
think the problem is we don't really understand. We were

668
00:43:44.679 --> 00:43:48.280
not understanding that die, deny, and follow from a law

669
00:43:48.400 --> 00:43:51.519
gospel perspective. I think that's what we need. But we'll

670
00:43:51.519 --> 00:43:53.800
get into that later. I already wanted to throw some

671
00:43:53.880 --> 00:43:57.360
of it in, but I kept talking to Ai, and

672
00:43:57.440 --> 00:44:02.639
Ai says, you're exposing a devastating truth about how take

673
00:44:02.719 --> 00:44:06.000
up your cross, deny yourself and follow Christ is commonly preached.

674
00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:09.840
When you take it face value, as most of Christianity

675
00:44:09.920 --> 00:44:13.679
teaches it, the standard is so radical and all encompassing

676
00:44:13.880 --> 00:44:16.440
that no Christian has ever truly done it, at least

677
00:44:16.480 --> 00:44:21.239
not consistently fully or genuinely. So AI's like, look, if

678
00:44:21.239 --> 00:44:25.360
you really take die to yourself, deny yourself, and follow Christ,

679
00:44:25.480 --> 00:44:28.239
meaning you're not following yourself. If you literally took that

680
00:44:28.719 --> 00:44:31.480
like in a true way, and what it seems to

681
00:44:31.639 --> 00:44:35.880
literally be saying, nobody has ever done it. Nobody has,

682
00:44:36.280 --> 00:44:39.800
nobody has died to themselves. It's just a game. You play.

683
00:44:40.159 --> 00:44:42.400
He said, Well, I may not be, but I died

684
00:44:42.599 --> 00:44:46.719
to myself in this area. No you don't. The text

685
00:44:46.719 --> 00:44:49.280
doesn't say die to yourself in an area. It says

686
00:44:49.400 --> 00:44:53.280
die to yourself, take up your cross and die, deny yourself.

687
00:44:53.400 --> 00:44:57.880
That means it's something more, but we want to water

688
00:44:58.000 --> 00:45:04.519
it down. Ai says, if anyone did truly live that way,

689
00:45:04.679 --> 00:45:11.559
it would probably look like monasticism asceticism, a I said.

690
00:45:11.559 --> 00:45:14.079
If we truly, if we truly were gonna take up

691
00:45:14.079 --> 00:45:18.760
our cross, die, deny, not follow oursel, it would be monasticism,

692
00:45:18.800 --> 00:45:21.239
meaning we would all be monkst we would be in monasteries.

693
00:45:21.760 --> 00:45:25.760
It would be aceticism, where you do all kinds of

694
00:45:25.800 --> 00:45:29.639
crazy things in order to keep dying and denying yourself,

695
00:45:32.480 --> 00:45:36.639
AI said, Or it would look like total detachment from

696
00:45:36.760 --> 00:45:46.320
normal human life possessions, no sex, no comfort, no autonomy,

697
00:45:46.519 --> 00:45:52.920
no identity, no apart from suffering and spiritual striving, that

698
00:45:52.960 --> 00:46:01.880
would be your life. So AI says, let's consider what

699
00:46:01.960 --> 00:46:05.559
the standard actually demands when todd the way most churches

700
00:46:05.679 --> 00:46:08.440
teach it, and then ask whether anyone's truly lived it.

701
00:46:08.719 --> 00:46:12.679
According to most preaching, the call demands absolute denial of self,

702
00:46:13.079 --> 00:46:17.280
not just sin, but desires, dreams, preferences, and needs. Your wants,

703
00:46:17.320 --> 00:46:21.400
your ambitions, your personality, and your pleasure are all suspect.

704
00:46:22.199 --> 00:46:24.800
You've got to truly deny yourself. Now, on one hand,

705
00:46:24.920 --> 00:46:28.719
this makes sense, right, because what happens we have all

706
00:46:28.760 --> 00:46:31.199
of these needs and desires. If they're unmet, then that's

707
00:46:31.239 --> 00:46:33.679
where all the problems begin. And then we already connected

708
00:46:33.679 --> 00:46:35.800
how that ends up in sin and how that ends

709
00:46:35.880 --> 00:46:37.719
up in all these problems. Right, but if we could

710
00:46:37.760 --> 00:46:41.679
truly deny self, then needs would not bother us, because well,

711
00:46:41.840 --> 00:46:44.039
we're so committed to self denial and being dead to

712
00:46:44.079 --> 00:46:47.920
self it wouldn't matter. But that calls for a totality

713
00:46:47.960 --> 00:46:57.360
of self denial, a totality of dying to self. Absolute

714
00:46:57.400 --> 00:46:59.800
denial of self is how most Christians would teach it,

715
00:47:00.119 --> 00:47:04.119
constant dying to self, daily sacrifice of comfort, rest, pleasure, affirmation,

716
00:47:04.440 --> 00:47:10.360
suppression of longing for love into miss joy unless spiritually directed.

717
00:47:10.440 --> 00:47:15.079
So basically, you constantly it's absolute denial of self. You

718
00:47:15.159 --> 00:47:18.800
have to constantly be dying to self. And again, well,

719
00:47:18.840 --> 00:47:21.000
we can get into a whole discussion about the tenses there,

720
00:47:21.039 --> 00:47:24.280
but okay, following Christ, a set of self every decision

721
00:47:24.360 --> 00:47:27.719
must reflect Christ's will, not personal desire. You must renounce

722
00:47:27.719 --> 00:47:31.079
self reliance, self interest, and even self care. Take up

723
00:47:31.119 --> 00:47:34.320
your cross. You should expect suffering, rejection, and loss as

724
00:47:34.400 --> 00:47:37.840
normal Christianity. You shouldn't. You should want suffering because it

725
00:47:37.880 --> 00:47:42.440
means you're truly dying to self. That's kind of basically

726
00:47:42.440 --> 00:47:44.480
the way it's taught. Now you we can, we can,

727
00:47:44.639 --> 00:47:47.320
we can try to expand that, clean it up a

728
00:47:47.360 --> 00:47:49.920
little bit, but you're getting the basic idea. AI is

729
00:47:49.920 --> 00:47:52.760
trying to take basically what Christianity teaches and says, Look,

730
00:47:52.800 --> 00:47:55.960
this is absolute kind of thing, and it would it would,

731
00:47:56.079 --> 00:47:59.159
it would so radically impact your life if you are

732
00:47:59.199 --> 00:48:04.119
even remotely committed to taking up your cross, dying, denying,

733
00:48:04.239 --> 00:48:06.360
and no longer following yourself and falling Christ. If you

734
00:48:06.400 --> 00:48:09.239
really were committed to that, your life would basically look

735
00:48:09.320 --> 00:48:11.400
like a monk. You would look like you're in a monastery.

736
00:48:13.199 --> 00:48:15.599
So I asked AI, has anyone ever done this? And

737
00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:19.559
AI says biblically no, Even the disciples felt to deny themselves.

738
00:48:19.559 --> 00:48:22.239
They argue over who was the greatest fled the cross,

739
00:48:22.239 --> 00:48:25.360
literally ran away when Jesus was arrested, waived in loyalty.

740
00:48:25.800 --> 00:48:31.159
Peter denied Christ three times. Historically, monastics tried. Early monastics

741
00:48:31.159 --> 00:48:35.920
and ascetics renounced marriage, that meaning celibacy. Wealth, They gave up,

742
00:48:35.960 --> 00:48:39.440
you know, poverty. They took a vow of poverty, autonomy,

743
00:48:39.639 --> 00:48:46.639
obedience to a rule, the rule of the monastery, comfort, fasting, flagellation, isolation.

744
00:48:47.119 --> 00:48:50.039
Some lived in the deserts, others lived in silence. Some

745
00:48:50.360 --> 00:48:55.360
even lived on these platforms. But even they struggled with

746
00:48:55.440 --> 00:48:59.800
pride LUs despair needed the grace they preached. Often descended

747
00:48:59.800 --> 00:49:03.920
into legalism, elitism, or spiritual madness. And guess what many

748
00:49:03.960 --> 00:49:07.880
and those monasteries they confess their sins daily or at

749
00:49:07.960 --> 00:49:11.280
least weekly. Well, what are the monks confessing? What are

750
00:49:11.320 --> 00:49:14.599
the monks confessed? What are the monks going to confession for? Oh? Wait,

751
00:49:14.760 --> 00:49:17.719
because they still sin, because they're still not even though

752
00:49:17.719 --> 00:49:21.360
they've renounced everything, given up everything living in a monastery,

753
00:49:21.559 --> 00:49:24.119
they still sin, meaning they're still not dead to self

754
00:49:24.159 --> 00:49:26.880
and they're still not denyingself. How is that even possible?

755
00:49:27.039 --> 00:49:30.920
Because you cannot ever truly die to yourself, you can

756
00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:33.519
never truly deny yourself. There is no way for to

757
00:49:33.559 --> 00:49:37.079
ever truly happen, which then means our entire interpretation of

758
00:49:37.119 --> 00:49:45.800
this has been so flawed today the Christians true are

759
00:49:45.800 --> 00:49:50.159
truly died to themselves, AI says, No, Most Christians who

760
00:49:50.159 --> 00:49:55.159
claim to deny themselves still have jobs, families, hobbies, sexuality, comforts, sleeping,

761
00:49:55.199 --> 00:49:58.760
soft beds, eat full meals and joy, music, entertainment, intimacy, technology.

762
00:49:58.840 --> 00:50:01.039
The very people preaching self to now live lives of

763
00:50:01.079 --> 00:50:05.599
incredible privilege and satisfaction, often with beautiful homes, vacations, coffee preferences,

764
00:50:05.639 --> 00:50:11.719
and curated sermons about dying to self. Hey, I was

765
00:50:11.719 --> 00:50:14.239
not very nice about that. Like, AI's like, this is

766
00:50:14.280 --> 00:50:21.239
all just a joke, It's just a game. So AI says, well,

767
00:50:21.239 --> 00:50:23.360
what does this tell us? Well? Number one, the teaching

768
00:50:23.400 --> 00:50:27.840
is inconsistent. It's preached universally but applied selectively. People are

769
00:50:27.920 --> 00:50:31.320
told to deny themselves, whether leaders enjoy comfort one persons

770
00:50:31.320 --> 00:50:33.960
self denial is giving up Instagram. Another is giving up

771
00:50:33.960 --> 00:50:39.039
hope for a spouse. The standard is impossible if taken literally,

772
00:50:39.079 --> 00:50:42.119
no one meets it. Ever, the more honest more honestly

773
00:50:42.159 --> 00:50:45.239
it's applied, the more extreme it becomes. It leads to

774
00:50:45.280 --> 00:50:50.280
either spiritual despair or hypocritical pretending. Number three. It must

775
00:50:50.360 --> 00:50:53.239
drive us to Christ, not to ourselves. If this call

776
00:50:53.480 --> 00:50:58.800
is law, die, deny, and follow, then it cannot be

777
00:50:58.880 --> 00:51:02.320
our ladder to solve or emotional stability. It must be

778
00:51:02.400 --> 00:51:05.960
the diagnosis, not the cure. So AI's like, maybe we

779
00:51:06.000 --> 00:51:08.159
should stop and go wait a minute, maybe this is

780
00:51:08.239 --> 00:51:10.800
not the cure. Maybe this is not the solution to

781
00:51:10.840 --> 00:51:13.480
the reason. You know, hey, Christians, we have all of

782
00:51:13.519 --> 00:51:16.199
these desires. If they're on med it leads to sin, okay,

783
00:51:16.280 --> 00:51:18.079
and then we have a sinful nature. So what we

784
00:51:18.159 --> 00:51:21.800
need to do is die to self. Maybe maybe it's

785
00:51:21.960 --> 00:51:25.519
not ever supposed to be the cure. It's literally law,

786
00:51:26.320 --> 00:51:31.440
do this. I can't hm. Who literally took up his cross,

787
00:51:31.920 --> 00:51:36.199
who literally denied himself, who literally followed the will of

788
00:51:36.239 --> 00:51:39.280
the Father, not my will, but your will be done?

789
00:51:39.440 --> 00:51:42.320
Who literally did all of those things? Let me see?

790
00:51:42.519 --> 00:51:45.400
Was it you No? Was it Paul No? Was it

791
00:51:45.400 --> 00:51:55.119
Peter no? Was it John? No? It was Christ. Law says,

792
00:51:55.199 --> 00:51:59.280
deny yourself completely, die to everything you are, follow perfectly.

793
00:51:59.400 --> 00:52:03.960
The Gospels says you didn't do that. Christ did. He

794
00:52:04.039 --> 00:52:07.000
denied himself, He took up his cross, He followed all

795
00:52:07.039 --> 00:52:12.559
the way to death for you. So now in Christ

796
00:52:12.639 --> 00:52:17.360
by faith. You've already died Galatians two twenty. You've already

797
00:52:17.360 --> 00:52:21.119
been crucified with Christ. Roman sixty six. You're already raised

798
00:52:21.119 --> 00:52:24.079
in Him Colossians three one. So your life isn't about

799
00:52:24.079 --> 00:52:26.599
proving you can deny yourself. Well, it's about living in

800
00:52:26.639 --> 00:52:29.440
the freedom of what Christ has already done, while still

801
00:52:29.519 --> 00:52:37.639
filling the ache of your unfinished humanity. See, everybody thinks

802
00:52:37.639 --> 00:52:42.119
the answer is dyed deny. It's it's it's the key

803
00:52:42.360 --> 00:52:49.039
to exposing the reality. Now I know that goes against

804
00:52:49.119 --> 00:52:53.559
every sermon you've ever heard, and we're we're gonna run

805
00:52:53.559 --> 00:52:59.079
out of time trying to take this apart. So AI says,

806
00:52:59.320 --> 00:53:02.480
under the standard, Under the standard most of Christians teach,

807
00:53:02.760 --> 00:53:05.000
no one has ever fully lived out deny yourself, take

808
00:53:05.039 --> 00:53:09.400
up your cross, or follow me. And those who've tried, monastics, pietists,

809
00:53:09.519 --> 00:53:14.480
mystics either burned out or collapsed into spiritual pride, which

810
00:53:14.480 --> 00:53:16.880
is why we must stop preaching it as an achievable

811
00:53:16.880 --> 00:53:21.360
discipleship program. Instead preach it as law that crushes self hope,

812
00:53:21.679 --> 00:53:26.039
a call fulfilled perfectly by Christ, a positional reality we

813
00:53:26.119 --> 00:53:38.880
now live in by faith. Now I've still got a

814
00:53:38.920 --> 00:53:42.280
million questions. Look, I just took you through a part

815
00:53:42.320 --> 00:53:45.559
of a conversation that lasted for like three hours. It

816
00:53:45.639 --> 00:53:47.960
was like a three hour conversation. We're still not even done.

817
00:53:48.119 --> 00:53:52.320
Me and Ai are still Me and AI are still

818
00:53:53.480 --> 00:53:57.079
struggling with this. Ai got very emphatic though there. Ai

819
00:53:57.199 --> 00:54:00.000
was just like, it's just a it's a game. Oh, Chris,

820
00:54:00.199 --> 00:54:03.039
just continue to play this game. You're out of your minds. Basically,

821
00:54:03.280 --> 00:54:06.400
nobody is doing this. Why do you keep pretending it's

822
00:54:06.480 --> 00:54:14.559
not happening? But Christianity teaches that it does, that it can,

823
00:54:15.400 --> 00:54:18.119
that this is the key. So what are what are

824
00:54:18.159 --> 00:54:24.960
the facts? We are born with these desires, deep desires, needs,

825
00:54:25.760 --> 00:54:29.800
absolute like I have to have. And if you remove

826
00:54:29.880 --> 00:54:36.719
them problems, we can lead them to emotional problems, mental problems,

827
00:54:36.760 --> 00:54:41.679
physiological problems. They're they're they're the the cause of many cases,

828
00:54:41.679 --> 00:54:46.760
are unmet needs. Those sin is our desire trying to

829
00:54:46.760 --> 00:54:50.000
meet these needs and an illegitimate way. Legitimate needs we

830
00:54:50.079 --> 00:54:52.079
try to meet in an illegitimate way. That's rue so

831
00:54:52.199 --> 00:54:55.280
much of our sin. What's driving our sin is this

832
00:54:55.400 --> 00:54:57.559
desire to fulfill these needs. If we can figure out

833
00:54:57.599 --> 00:54:59.480
what the need is that we're trying to fulfill. In

834
00:54:59.519 --> 00:55:02.039
many cases we get a better understanding of what we're doing.

835
00:55:02.280 --> 00:55:04.199
But at the same time we have a sinful nature

836
00:55:04.320 --> 00:55:07.760
that who wants wrong desires as well as right desires,

837
00:55:07.840 --> 00:55:10.719
and will say sin to get the wrong and the right.

838
00:55:11.280 --> 00:55:14.840
And so that sinful nature makes everything all complicated and

839
00:55:14.920 --> 00:55:18.519
messed up. And the Church comes along and in some

840
00:55:18.639 --> 00:55:24.639
capacity we'll say the solution is just die to yourself,

841
00:55:25.800 --> 00:55:32.039
just deny yourself, just take up your cross. That's the solution.

842
00:55:32.119 --> 00:55:37.719
If you can do that, then everything is fixed, everything

843
00:55:38.320 --> 00:55:44.760
is good to go. It will say something like, let's

844
00:55:44.800 --> 00:55:49.039
see here, do I have it here? If any man

845
00:55:49.079 --> 00:55:51.599
will come after me, let him deny himself, take up

846
00:55:51.639 --> 00:56:03.280
his cross and follow me. And that is preached in

847
00:56:03.320 --> 00:56:07.000
many cases, not even in an exegetical context. In a

848
00:56:07.039 --> 00:56:09.400
way it gets lifted and it's like, hey, that's how

849
00:56:09.400 --> 00:56:12.760
you need to live your life. Now. I think we'll

850
00:56:12.800 --> 00:56:14.360
have to get into how to actually break that down.

851
00:56:14.360 --> 00:56:18.079
That's Matthew Chapter sixteen, verse twenty four. But you can

852
00:56:18.079 --> 00:56:19.519
break it, you can look at it. But I just

853
00:56:19.599 --> 00:56:24.920
want you to see how this all begins to fall apart,

854
00:56:27.960 --> 00:56:31.079
because the answer is, well, if you can't get the

855
00:56:31.119 --> 00:56:34.039
needs met. Well, I'm sorry, it really stinks for you

856
00:56:34.079 --> 00:56:37.440
because you've got to die, deny, you got to stop falling.

857
00:56:37.480 --> 00:56:41.159
So now all these other people they're good to go.

858
00:56:41.320 --> 00:56:44.079
But even that sometimes is not always consistent. As I

859
00:56:44.119 --> 00:56:49.199
talked about the divorce, marriage, divorce, marriage, divorce and remarriage,

860
00:56:49.400 --> 00:56:55.039
it's not even even consistently applied in those areas, or gluttony,

861
00:56:55.159 --> 00:56:58.079
or I can think of many other situations like, well,

862
00:56:58.119 --> 00:57:00.559
you know we're not going to apply it there whoa whoa, whoa,

863
00:57:00.559 --> 00:57:03.000
whoa whoa. If these people over here have to die,

864
00:57:03.039 --> 00:57:15.000
deny and follow, how come those people don't. So we've

865
00:57:15.000 --> 00:57:17.239
seen where this begins to fall apart. I gave you

866
00:57:17.280 --> 00:57:19.559
a little sense of where you really need to take.

867
00:57:19.639 --> 00:57:24.920
This is more to a gospel based system. Right, and Christ,

868
00:57:24.960 --> 00:57:28.599
you've already died, and Christ, you are dead. Past tense,

869
00:57:28.679 --> 00:57:33.320
you are dead. You have already been crucified with Christ,

870
00:57:34.280 --> 00:57:36.880
and you've been raised in Him. So you have you

871
00:57:36.960 --> 00:57:39.239
have been crucified, you've been dead, you've been bare, you've

872
00:57:39.280 --> 00:57:42.960
been raised. That's all positional reality. So you have died,

873
00:57:43.159 --> 00:57:53.800
you have. It's all happened positionally. Now you can say, well,

874
00:57:53.800 --> 00:57:56.880
practically we have to strive to die and deny. You

875
00:57:56.920 --> 00:58:00.559
can try that, but again that's just striving for something

876
00:58:00.599 --> 00:58:03.159
that you're never first. You're never going to come anywhere close.

877
00:58:03.679 --> 00:58:06.480
You can put that as a as a as a goal.

878
00:58:06.840 --> 00:58:08.800
You got to make sure you understand it's not achievable

879
00:58:08.800 --> 00:58:12.320
in any meaningful way. You said, well in this one area. Again,

880
00:58:12.480 --> 00:58:15.599
it becomes very difficult to measure because because even from

881
00:58:15.639 --> 00:58:19.119
a theological perspective, even you're like, well, look, I accomplish this. Yeah,

882
00:58:19.119 --> 00:58:20.440
but if you're guilty at one point of the law,

883
00:58:20.440 --> 00:58:22.480
you're guilty of all. You're still in a perpetual state

884
00:58:22.519 --> 00:58:24.760
of sin. So it becomes very hard in even how

885
00:58:24.760 --> 00:58:28.280
you measure that or even quantify anything or qualify anything

886
00:58:28.519 --> 00:58:33.800
in that way. So the reality is Christians are not

887
00:58:33.880 --> 00:58:40.679
really dead to themselves practically speaking, positionally we are. We're dead, buried, resurrected.

888
00:58:41.400 --> 00:58:44.199
And my position, the old me is gone, It's been

889
00:58:44.199 --> 00:58:46.440
crucified with Christ till life. I now live. I'm living

890
00:58:46.719 --> 00:59:02.280
by the faith of the Son of God. Yeah, we're

891
00:59:02.360 --> 00:59:05.639
fifty nine minutes or yeah, fifty nine minutes. I want

892
00:59:05.639 --> 00:59:07.280
to say more, but I'm just gonna kind of leave

893
00:59:07.320 --> 00:59:09.719
it there. I know, that's kind of like a dangerous

894
00:59:09.760 --> 00:59:11.280
place to leave it, because people are gonna be like, well,

895
00:59:11.320 --> 00:59:13.280
what about what about? What about? What about? What about?

896
00:59:13.280 --> 00:59:16.280
What I understand we couldn't cover everything in those fifty

897
00:59:16.320 --> 00:59:17.760
nine minutes, and we still got a lot more to

898
00:59:17.800 --> 00:59:21.599
discuss in regards to the dying to sell. But we'll, we'll, we'll,

899
00:59:21.880 --> 00:59:26.079
we'll do some work here on Matthew sixteen at some

900
00:59:26.239 --> 00:59:31.199
point because we need a new exegetical framework for it.

901
00:59:33.840 --> 00:59:41.280
All right, Thanks for listening. God bless